Docutech Community
DOCUTECH => RETIREE NEWS => Topic started by: allancoleman on November 18, 2003, 04:44:52 AM
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this forum / topic will be used mostly as a informational posting area for news of interest to present and future retirees . i will attempt to delete prior newsletter postings of xerox retiree clubs to reduce the number of posts in this forum a new reader has to wade through in order to catch up because most xerox retiree club newsletters are archived on their own sites . any suggestions or questions or comments are welcome . this is your forum . i'm just the messenger . :)
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National Retiree Legislative Network issued a press release relating to two bills ( H.R.1231 & S.623 ) to extend pre - tax health care preminum payments to all retirees . more details available at : http://www.NRLN.ORG . this is a good site to keep up with current legislation as it pertains to retirees . enjoy .
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National Retiree Legislative Network has a newsletter on their site : NRLN.ORG that brings members up to date with the end of this calendar year's legislation and mentions this organization's outlook for next year 's ( 2004 ) legislative session . one of the bills mentioned is H.R.1322 ( and it's senate bill - S.2904 ) that is the Emergency Retiree Health Benefit Protection Act that protects retiree's health care benefits AFTER retirement . more details at NRLN.ORG .
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Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation ( PBGC ) announces the Maximum Guarantee Rates for the year 2004 . PBGC doesn't guarantee the full pensions of the failed pension plans they take over in all cases . this web site : PBGC.GOV is a good one for research on pensions and especially lump sum pension calculations . there is archived interest rates going back a few years . this will be a good site to see what effect the new lump sum legislation will have in 2004 .
remember the logic used in lump sum calculations is : the LOWER the interest rate used in the lump sum calculation , the HIGHER the lump sum has to be to fund the same pension . just as the HIGHER the interest rate used in the lump sum calculation , the LOWER the lump sum pay out will be on the exact same pension . much more information at their web site . enjoy .
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it appears that sheldon's web site , THECSE.COM , has taken it's final breath :( . for a long while now the messages board on that site was not functional but the site was still there . now it appears to have totally disappeared .
i would like to take this time to thank sheldon :) , where ever you are , for providing us with a place to whine , complain , vent , communicate , and generally information share . hopefully this xertech site will become our new home to accomplish those same goals that sheldon had in mind when he started that site .
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the profit sharing / 401(k) council of america ( PSCA ) reported the passage of H.R.2420 yesterday ( 11/20/2003 ) by the house of representatives by a vote of 418 to 2 . this is the Mutual Funds Integrity and Fee Transparency Act of 2003 that prevents late trading without disadvantaging 401(k) and other employer - provided retirement plan participants . a press release on a similar matter was reported here by this organization on the 19th of november to the SEC ( securities and exchange commission ) . more details at their web site : http://www.PSCA.ORG
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A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) has a poll at their web site ( http://www.ARXE.ORG[/url] ) for their members to take . it's basicly questions about the open enrollment process that we just completed . A.R.X.E. will begin another series of talks with xerox for next year's medical coverage issues in december .
this organization is worth the $ 10 bucks that you spend . help them help to support you . remember you have to be a member to be able to view their entire web site and you can join on line . enjoy .
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the house of representives recently ( 11/20/03 ) pased the Tax Extender / Pension Funding bill : H.R. 3521 . this bill extends numerous tax breaks that were set to expire and provide pension funding relief to more than 30,000 businesses with " defined - benefit " plans that pay retiress a set amount .
xerox corporation's RIGP is a " defined - benefit " plan .
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i just received a personal e - mail from MDr requesting more information on the RIGP lawsuit hearing that MDr said took place november 14th in illinois .
without going to numerous sources i've quoted here in the past ( mostly from A.R.X.E. - association of retired xerox employees ) , the RIGP lawsuit is the Berger vs RIGP lawsuit that has been on going for probably over 10 years now . originally there was an alleged 25,00 plaintiffs named in the class action lawsuit , mainly those people who retired and received lump sum checks from january 1st , 1990 until december 31st , 1999 . the plaintiffs recently named in the suit with xerox are about 14,800 in number . people directly involved in the lawsuit received a letter asking them if they would agree to a legal fee of about $80m out of the proposed $239m settlement . i am a xerox retiree but was not named in the lawsuit because the RIGP formula ( a " defined - benefit " plan ) was not used to determine my lump sum payment in my individual case and i retired the first quarter of 2000 and therefore i didn't receive a letter . keep in mind xerox's policy of paying the " higher of the three " sums ( cash balance account , transitional account or RIGP ) used in lump sum calculations . without getting entirely too technical , there are actually four different calculations but we'll keep it simple here by stating xerox's present policy . but several of my xeroid retiree friends did receive such letters . the best place to receive information on this if you are a xerox retiree is at : ARXE.ORG . they have a complete section on this lawsuit on their web site because of the request of their membership . the last posting that A.R.X.E. had was november 14th that stated a proposed settlement was in progress . i will do further research and add to this posting in the future if i have better information as to a good site for you if you aren't a xerox retiree and don't have access to A.R.X.E. ( and as a reminder you must be a member to A.R.X.E. to be able to access all of their site ) . but the work they do for xerox retirees is well worth their $ 10 annual fee . you can join on line . if you have any questions as to your pension rights i suggest you go to the pension rights center at : PENSIONRIGHTS.ORG . they have a " pension help " and a " more pension help " links to assist those who have questions regarding their pension rights .
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national news just reported that the new medicare drug bill passed the senate with a 54 to 44 vote last nite . it will now go to the president for his signing . i'm sure my normal sources will be posting on their web sites later about their opinions on this issue . enjoy .
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the minutes of the november 14th Dallas Fort Worth chapter of the A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) is available at the A.R.X.E. web site : ARXE.ORG . this first meeting of this first local chapter of the A.R.X.E. was attended by 38 members , which was 71% of the currently registered membership . they elected officers and mentioned issues important going forward for this chapter . membership is limited to the area contiguous to ZIP codes 75xxx and 76xxx .
you must be a member to access the A.R.X.E. web site . this is the first of hopefully many local chapters . enjoy .
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A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) board met november 14th and has decided to initiate a membership with the national retiree legislative network ( NRLN.ORG ) . we have also reported on this association and their web site here on this web board . A.R.X.E. ( ARXE.ORG ) has decided although they don't agree on every single stance that the N.R.L.N. has offered , that they are the best source for legislative progress . and i agree with that view and have reported same here . more details at the A.R.X.E. web site .
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A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) reports that the benefits confirmations are being mailed out today ( december 5th ) . the final pricing with the maximum out of pocket cap will be reflected in the confirmation .
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N.R.L.N. ( national retiree legislative network ) reported on a survey done by Hart Research that showed that 19 % of people 55 and older approve of the current medicare drug bill and 64 % say congress should go back and work on a better prescription drug benefit . more details at : NRLN.ORG .
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President Bush signed into law today the Medicare Drug bill ( H.R.1 / S.1 ) . there are those on the other side of the of congress lining up to introduce legislation to modify this legislation . N.R.L.N. ( national retiree legislative network ) at : NRLN.ORG is one who issued a " red alert " concerning parts of the bill that do not prevent companies ( xerox is one through caremark ) presently offering drug care benefits to retirees from dropping that coverage now that medicare is picking it up . this will be a interesting issue to watch in future years .
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P.B.G.C. ( pension benefit guarantee corporation ) restates support for prompt passage of H.R.3108 ( the Pension Funding Equity Act of 2003 ) . this legislation allows companies to use a higher corporate rate for pension funding for two years to allow congress more time for legislation to fix the pension problem . more details at : PBGC.GOV . this is a good site to educate yourself as to the pension problem . they have a " interest rate " link where you can look at past interest rates used in lump sum pension calculations . enjoy .
the logic used in the math in lump sum calculations is : the HIGHER the interest rate used in lump sum calculations , the LOWER the lump sum will be to fund that pension . just as the LOWER the interest rate used in the lump sum calculation , the HIGHER the lump sum will be for the same pension . and of course we have been at historic lows for interest rates and companies are have difficulty paying the higher lump sums associated with those lower interest rates . by the way , xerox's pension plan is fully funded , if not over funded at this time . but that's not the case for most pension plans .
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General Motors made a commitment to contribute 4.1 billion to it's pension plan if the sale of Hughes Electronics to News Corp closes this year . this would almost fully fund their plan and make their present and future retirees happy i'm sure . there are presently 2.5 retirees for every active worker at this time . this would help to reverse a trend that has underfunded pension plans in the past .
this would bring General Motors total contribution to their plan this year to 18.5 billion fueled by a historic debt deal earlier this summer .
General Motors also mentioned they would change the asset allocation in their pension plan from 60% stocks to 50% stocks . this is being done in addition to other asset allocation changes to make their pension plan more invested in other asset classes .
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NRLN ( national retiree legislative network ) at NRLN.ORG has issued a bulletin to the public that they lost the battle on the medicare drug bill due to AARP , association of retired people , and NRLN is asking the public to lobby AARP about this issue .
this , plus the future legislation being prepared now to change this past bill will make this a issue to watch in following years . battle lines seem to being drawn up now on this issue .
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on a personal note , i received my confirmation statement from xerox / hewitt on my medical costs for next year ( 2004 ) and i will share them with you .
my annual medical costs this year ( 2003 ) were $ 2,244 or $ 187 @ month for the wife and i BOTH for medical & dental ( no vision ) .
my annual medical costs next year ( 2004 ) are $ 3,196 or $ 266 @ month for the same coverage .
in comparison , many of my retired friends pay TWICE to FOUR times this amount and don't have the choices i do on medical coverage . when i retired i thought the retiree medical coverage was probably one of the best benefits i received from xerox . and in spite of the increases , i have not changed my mind on that feeling . i have a friend who is a xeroid retiree and is on medicare and his costs are much lower .
so if those of you who aren't retired yet can hang in there through the changes a company has to face now to stay in business , it's a worth while struggle . lastly , hewitt / xerox bills retirees quarterly for their medical coverage , but several years ago i started sending them a single check ( ceritified mail - return receipt ) to cover the entire annual costs in the beginning of each year because of my life style ( snow bird & travel ) and they have accepted it . now , i'm not concerned about missing a medical coverage payment while i'm gone from my permanent mailing address and losing my coverage .
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the profit sharing / 401(k) council of america put the 2004 i.r.s. pension plan limits on their web page : PSCA.ORG . there is other information pertaining to retirement & pensions on this web site . enjoy .
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earlier this week , the nation's largest public pension fund , the $ 154 billion dollar California Public Employee Retirement System issued a class action lawsuit against the largest stock exchange , the New York Stock Exchange , and seven trading firms alleging practices that cost the retirement system millions of dollars in recent years .
CalPERS and other huge public pension funds , controlling hundreds of billions of dollars in nine states have insisted that the proposed NYSE reforms are insufficient . CalPERS decided to sue rather than rely on the SEC , Securities and Exchange Commission because the agency had not fulfilled its regulatory duties .
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A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) has released a update on the RIGP lawsuit . the next hearing is scheduled for january 22th . letters were sent out to members of the class action suit december 15th by the judge . if you did not receive a letter about the lawsuit then you aren't part of the settlement . more details at ARXE.ORG . ARXE said they would release further details when they have them .
my friend who is part of the class and received the letter said the letter said some settlements would be as little as $ 2k and some settlements would be as much as $ 100k . of course , the , more $ 100k settlements , the more $ 2k amounts there will be . when you divide 14,000 members of the class into the amount left after the legal fees , it doesn't leave much .
A.R.X.E. is making a push for new members . they now have 1,400 + out of a total of 21,000 + retired u.s. employees . the more membership they have the better they can speak for you in discussions on going with xerox . you can join on line at : ARXE.ORG . you must be a member to sign on and view their whole site .
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the matterofchoice web ( MATTEROFCHOICE.COM ) site now reflects your true costs for your xerox medical coverage for 2004 . this site is available for xerox employees to access their benefits and to research through the others links on the site other benefit information such as health care providers , comparing different plans , medicare questions , etc .
i understand that this site is available to retirees year round ( has been to me anyway ) , but current employees can only access the site durning open enrollment periods . so if you're a current employee and can't log on to the site , that might be the reason .
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NRLN ( National Retiree Legislative Network ) issues a press release ( a letter by A.J.( Jim ) Norby ) about their active agenda for 2004 . more details at their web site at : NRLN.ORG
this organization has decided to allow membership by individuals . $ 10 a year was mentioned as the fee . i'm thinking about joining if they decide to sent out a regular newsletter or restrict " members only " on portions of their web site such as A.R.X.E. does . in the past the membership was by organization . and as i reported in the past , A.R.X.E. was looking at joining N.R.L.N. so i may already enjoy the benefits of a membership without paying for it . more details on both sites .
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the pension benefit guaranty corp issued a press release about the court ruling by the court in PBGC's favor in it's claims against U S Airways whose pension plan PBGC took over this last summer ( 2003 ) .
reading this article by the executive director of PBGC , Steven A. Kandarian , gives one a good ideal of the pension problem . especially by companies that want to turn their pension obligations over to tax payers .
details available at http://www.PBGC.GOV . this is a good site for pension research . they archive past interest rates used for pension calculations too .
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the executive director , Steven A. Kandarian , of the pension benefit guaranty corporation has announced his departure . you can read his letter to the secretary of labor , Elaine L. Chao . you can read alot between the lines of the letter of the problems that face this agency that is running out of money to fund the pensions it has to take over . more details at : http://www.pbgc.gov . we can expect to hear more problems on pensions in the future . the trend is to defined contribution ( 401k 's , etc ) plans as compared to pensions ( defined benefit plans ) . stay tuned .
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the Pension Rights Center at their web site : http://www.PENSIONRIGHTS.ORG[/url] put a article , " Why Retirement Plans are falling short " , from the Christian Science Monitor dated january 5th under their " pension news " link on their web site . this is a good site for pension research and has several links to check your pension rights .
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United Airlines to cut retiree benefits . 35,000 retirees will be effected . United Airlines is now traded on the bulletin - board ( a stock is traded on the bulletin board and not one of the exchanges such as the NYSE , NASDAQ , AMEX , etc , if the stock price isn't high enough - anything less than five dollars a share is considered a " penny " stock on wall street ) under the stock ticker symbol : UALAQ . this is probably your best source for news on this issue . recent stock price ( 1/14/04 ) was $ 1.59 and that was AFTER going up on the news of cutting retiree benefits . :huh: so the company isn't exactly doing well . wonder what their ESOP's are worth in their retirement accounts ? ?
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Association of Retired Xerox Employees just posted a survey at their site ( http://www.ARXE.ORG[/url] ) for members to vote if they will be attending the 2004 annual meeting held this year in Rochester , New York on june 10 .
proxies and other materials will be sent to members of good standing in late april . when i voted in the poll , 59.62 % said they would be attending , 34.62 % said they would not attend , and 5.77 % said they were undecided .
the association is coming up with a venue for the meeting . more details on the web site . as a reminder , you MUST be a member to log in and see the entire site . you can join on line and help these guys support you to retain your retiree benefits .
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Pension Benefit Guarentee Corporation released their 2003 fiscal year results . the corporation suffered a deficit of $ 11.2 billion overall for last year . this is the highest yet . they presently have 34.5 million people in 29,500 failed pension plans under their wing at this time and growing more rapidly . do NOT assume ( remember what assume does to YOU and ME ) that if PBGC takes over your companies pension plan that you will still receive your full pension you were promised ( you could get just a fraction of your pension ) . more details available at their web site : http://www.PBGC.GOV
we will see more issues on pensions and pension benefits in the futu
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xerox has added to their http://www.MATTEROFCHOICE.COM[/url] web site under the FAQs tab a Retiree Billing link . this link gives you the retiree billing schedule - 2004 by quarter , invoice mailed by , and payment due by sections .
if you have any questions as to your billing on your medical , you might be able to get your own answers here without waiting on hold to talk to a real ( ? ) person . i solve my billing problems because of my snow bird life style by paying for my full year's medical amount when i get my first quarter's billing statement . then i don't hear from them the rest of the year and i don't have to worry about missing a quarterly bill and losing coverage .
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National Retiree Legislative Network posted on their web site ( http://www.NRLN.ORG[/url] ) a research study : " Companies Slash Retiree Benefits " updated january 14th , 2004 by Hewitt - Kaiser . more details available on their web site .
this press release is worth reading as it shows the trend with all companies to end or have retirees pay more for their benefits . this trend seems to be increasing .
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just received a response to my e - mail to the association of retired xerox employees regarding renewing my membership . they said they would bill me on my anniversity of my membership . all of my retiree associations have a renewal form in their january newsletters . so for you members wondering what to do . just sit tight . you'll get a bill sometime this next year .
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hi allen and friends,
a topic we discussed was the post-65 medical coverage. if anyone doesn't think that they need it just ask anyone over 65 how far they get without it, and if they priced out supplemental insurance. it's a real eye opener. as far as retirement accounts i lump summed and have been pleased with the results so far.
kilo869
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appreciate k869's input to this topic . xerox spent approx $ 350 million on benefits for approx 20,000 retirees and 40,000 u.s. employees in the recent past . with xerox being a " self insured " corporation , they have on going medical bills all year that must be paid and they won't know their total cost on their medical costs for the year until they close their books out on medical costs mid year the following year .
as for k869 taking his lump sum and being happy . 90% of the techs take the lump sum as a retirement option . part of the reason is because of the lower interest rate being at historic lower rates now , the lump sum payouts are at historic highs right now . there is legislation underway in congress right now to stop these historic high payouts for lump sums .
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received my bill today for my 2004 medical coverage . you should expect your bill too . if not , call hewitt / xerox before your payment is past due .
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the Profit Sharing / 401k Council of America issued a press release on their web site ( http://www.PSCA.ORG[/url] ) urging SEC ( securities and exchange commission ) to preserve a level playing field for all investors that does not relagate 401(k) and other employer provided plan participants to second class status .
more details available on their web site .
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just received from the Xerox Benefit Center a Customer Satisfaction Survey in the mail today . i filled it out and it should make their deadline of febuary 15th for return .
my survey reply was positive and my comment was that my transition to retirement with xerox was excellent due to the professional assistense i received from hewitt and that was one of the prime reasons i left most of my 401(k) with xerox / hewitt .
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soon i will be making that same decision,and moving everything to the 401k looks like the best game in town
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ifs ,
it certainly is not a " bad " game to play with your money . HOWEVER , you must be very careful taking any distributions out of your 401(k) . if you ANNUNITIZE your 401(k) , you can not roll it over in the future . in other words , if you take money out of your 401(k) in such a fashion that the balance remaining in your 401(k) lasts longer than 10 years , you can NEVER roll your 401(k) over to a I.R.A. later . that may or may not be important to you in the future .
if converting your deferred accounts to a roth is important to you then keeping those monies inside your 401(k) prevents that under current regulations . at present , the only deferred accounts you can CONVERT to a roth are those inside a I.R.A. . possibility in the future , when we have 401(k) roth's , there will be a way to convert your 401(k) money to a roth without rolling it to a rollover i .r.a. account first . 401(k) roth's are already enacted by law but not scheduled to take effect until 2006 ( we were originally scheduled to be told of this new savings vehicle in the fall of 2005 , but president bush wants to move that schedule up to this year ) .
when you read roth think TAX FREE . when you read deferred accounts ( i.r.a. , 403b , 457 , 401(k) , profit sharing , ESOP , etc ) , think income which means you'll pay income tax on the amount of your distribution . plus roth's are NOT effected by required minimum distributions at age 70 1/2 as are all deferred accounts including a 401(k) .
these and more details available by getting the latest 2003 ( for last year's income taxes - just released ) I.R.S. publication 590 ( Individual Retirement Arrangements ) or by calling xerox / hewitt .
none of this is meant to be specific investment advice . any and all investment decisions should be made by you and your investment advisor ( hopefully yourself for the sake of your wallet ;) ) .
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the u.s. senate began debate on 1/22/04 on H.R.3108 ( the Pension Funding Equity Act of 2003 ) . this legislation allows companies to change their pension funding calculation that presently uses the 30 year Treasury bond rate with a corporate bond rate . this could lower lump sum payment calculation amounts by 25% . looks like congress has awoke from a winter's holiday sleep and is beginning to deal with the pension problems that are still there .
p.s. see my post of december 9th , 2003 on page two of this topic for further details on this bill and the effects that interest rates have on determining your lump sum amount .
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Well Allen,
It appears that you've really done your homework, thank you for sharing with us. retirement ain't for wimps! I went lump-sum primarily because of an investment counseler that i had a lot of faith in and so far it's paid off. This is one area where cautioin can't be overemphasised.
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kilo869 ,
glad your investment advisor is working for you . i suggest that you continue to monitor your performance regularily . in this cyclical bull market rally we have had the last year , anyone can make money . the true test will come if we return to the secular bear market that began in the spring of 2000 .
there are those that say we are in a secular bear market that could last for decades where money invested in a money market account could out perform the stock market over that period of time . the last secular market we had was a bull market that lasted from 1982 until the end of 1999 . remember that anything you invested in durning the 90's made money . a secular bear market is different . it's more of a traders market and not so much a investors market . in other words , " buy and hold " works in a bull market . " buy and hold " DOES NOT work in a bear market .
careful with your critical mass because we're too old to lose and make another fortune .
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in doing some research on the http://www.PensionRights.ORG[/url] web site , i came across a link to Women's Pensions . this link is very good for the women on this board or for the guys to look into their spouses rights to their benefits after they are gone and have transferred to that last copier team . :)
specific mention was made of a bill , Women's Pension Protection Act of 2002 ( S.2707 ) . i will add this legislation to the others i am tracking . putting this bill into your favorite search engine and following the links is educational . especially for the ladies .
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senate passed H.R. 3108 ( amended 1/28/04 ) . this legislation would temporarily reduce pension contributions in hopes of preventing companies from terminating their plans .
please see my post of january 26th on page 4 of this topic and my post of december 9th , 2003 on page 2 on this topic for more on this legislation . my post of last year ( december 9th ) gives you a idea of what effect this legislation could have on the amount of lump sum calculations in the future .
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the xerox / hewitt web site ( http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url] ) that you normally access for your 401(k) numbers now directs any questions to exercise or information on your xerox stock options to the Smith Barney web site : http://www.benefitaccess.com[/url]
i found that when i separated from xerox that my xerox stock options expired one year later. and i received a letter from Smith Barney 30 days before that expiration date informing me of that information . word to the wise that have many more options than i had to deal with in their retirement planning after they leave the big X .
as a special note to readers , these stock options are , of course , history .
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a link to a article , " administration announces revised savings proposals - changes made to address ASPA's concerns " by the A S P A ( American Society of Pension Actuaries ) is available at : http://www.lifetimesavingsaccount.com[/url]
this article gives you a idea what may be in store for us in the future . this lifetimesavingsaccount.com web site also gives you access to other recent articles and is another good source for research .
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due to the request of their membership , the association of retired xerox employees issued a up date on the 7th on the RIGP settlement hearing that took place january 22nd . best information is that the judge accepted the settlement proposal ( it is unclear if there is any changes made to the original proposal going into the hearing ) . on or about february 22nd , the court will confirm the settlement and the process of paying the plaintiffs will begin . ARXE will post further details when they are available on their web site : http://www.arxe.org[/url]
i have several friends who were named in the suit and will report when i'm aware of their settlemant amounts . the arxe web site is only available to members . their membership is over 1,600 now and you can join on line . help them to support you in your retirement benefits .
for more information on this lawsuit , please see my posts of november 24th on page # 1 and december 19th on page # 2 . i will also give future updates when available .
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this may be of interest to those retirees who have left xerox but do not qualify for xerox's retiree health care . i have a friend who is a ex - xeroid looking for private individual health care plans and i was having difficulty getting around the AARP.ORG web site trying to find what i wanted so i plugged in bluecross in my search engine and came up with a good site . it is : http://www.bluecrossblueshield.com[/url] . i was impressed how easy to was to plug in your zip code and look at their medical plans .
so for those of you in need of medical health care coverage , you might check out this site .
of course this doesn't address the issue about weither blue cross health care is good or not . and i have heard mixed results from xerox retirees and current employees about blue cross . some like them / some don't . but probably " some " coverage is better than " no " coverage .
i personally have unitedhealth care and like it :) . for whatever that's worth . ?
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there is a web site for anyone who ever worked for xerox... xeroxalumni.org. $10.00 one time fee... it may be worthwhile.
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thanks for the post kilo869 . i put in a link for ya :) : http://www.xeroxalumni.org[/url]
p.s. i'm having difficulty getting to this site reliably , so be patient . i do know the site was good cause i checked it out before providing the link . perhaps they are having server problems ? i'm thinking about joining myself .
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hi allen, in cse anyone is not aware, that web site is very user friendly, and does give you a feeling of empowerment.
http://www.nrln.org/index.htm[/url]
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hi kilo869 ,
you're correct about the web site being good and that group is fighting the good fight for all retirees . unfortunately the trend is to lessen benefits . :(
it'll be interesting to watch the current legislative battle lines form
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i would like to call your attention to the " technicans seeking employment " forum on this site . looks like a tech got together with a job . something really worthwhile . kudos to xertech for setting this enviroment to allow this to happen . :D .
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it is not Kudo that is setting the employment. I hear a lot of place of self maintinaer and try to help them out. The company and a tech. Just being helpful to the business! :ph34r:
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Supreme Court issued a ruling ( 6 - 3 ) that younger workers can't sue their employers when older colleagues get preferential treatment .
in a 6 - 3 decision that effects tens of millions of workers , the justicies said the law that protects older employees from age didcrimination doesn't apply in reverse .
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Federal Reserve Chairmen Alan Greenspan urged Congress today to deal with the country's escalating budget deficit by cutting benefits for future Social Security retirees rather than raising taxes .
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on february 16th , the Advisory Committee of the Association of Retired Xerox Employees ( ARXE ) met with the Xerox Benefits Office Staff to continue the discussions on retiree HealthCare benefits .
some points brought out were that xerox contributed $ 672M to pension plans durning 2003 .
issues of the retiree Flex Newsletter are planned bi - monthly for February , April , June , August , and November .
inclusion of the Old Plan and the New Plan retirees in the distributions of the Benefits Newsletters was discussed .
ARXE core positions discussed :
core # 1 position - reintegration of the pre - 65 retiree flex population with the active flex plan population to create a common experience base for cost purposes
core # 2 position - medicare . called for xerox to continue to provide all of the current post - 65 xerox plan recipients with benefits in light of the medicare reform bill of 11 / 2003 .
core # 3 position - further improvement to open enrollment process .
core # 4 position - defined contribution plan .
more details at : http://www.arxe.org . this site is fully available to members only . you can join on line . help those to help you in preserving your retiree benefits .
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:angry: Allan,
I think Greenspan may have stepped on his unit when recommended cutting Social Security for the millions of "Baby Boomers" who are getting close to Social Security age...That is great way to get a whole administration tossed out on their ear, from the local elections all the way to the Presidential election..Too many of us have worked too hard and sacrificed too much to have to taken away just when we are ready to start using it..
As a 61 year old, I know it really frosts' me to even think that Social Security might be cut...Yesterday they cut the Commanche helicopter program, and that was after spending billions on it...The billions that they spent on that ill fated program was just money thrown out the window....I can think of lots of ways to cut the fat out of our government, from local government on up to the Feds...I see sooooo much waste on a daily basis...A lot of my customers are city, county, state and federal accounts and it is like there is no end to the money for them..I am also a resident of California so you probably know of what I speak, because of the condition this state has gotten itself into...Spend, spend ,spend and never worry about where the payback is coming from...
I am a card carrying Republican and Vietnam vet but I have really lost my respect for the present administration, and the policies that they have adopted...I could never in a million years vote for "JFK" Kerry but, on the other hand, there are not a whole lot of options out there...
We were deceived about the need to invade Iraq and, in my humble opinion, should have never gone there in the first place...If this is indeed a "War for Oil", then why am I paying $2.39 for a gallon of unleaded regular? We have spent untold billions since we invaded Iraq that could have been used in our own country to improve the quality of life here for the unemployed and the soon to be unemployed and for the millions who have had their health insurance dropped or severely cut by the corporations, like Xerox, who made so many hollow promises so many years ago...
I apologize for getting on my soapbox about the Greenspan thing but that was just about the last straw for me...Everyone who is on this forum has worked hard and paid their taxes like good American citizens and it just burns my butt to see people like Greenspan, who is a multi-millionaire, regurgitate the rhetoric that he did today..
Maybe we should start by cutting the retirement pensions of all our congressmen and senators...Let them see what it is like to watch the old retired folks having lunch at Costco(because it is the cheapest place in town) and going through the checkout with cases of pasta and cat food, and they don't own a cat...
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boatbum ,
you are not in the minority . appreciate your comments . keep in mind while you're expressing your anger :angry: that i'm just the messenger :unsure: .
joining the organizations that are fighting to preserve our benefits is the best way to reverse the trend to lesser benefits for which we all have paid . and there are many here whose web sites that i list , and more , from which i usually report their news .
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:rolleyes: Allan,
I never intended to kill the messenger..I have followed your posts since "The CSE" site and have enjoyed and learned from them...I am also a member of ARXE and have also learned a lot from that organization...I was ass deep in work and in the middle of the rain and snow storm that is hitting CA today when I heard of Greenspans remarks and it just about sent me over the edge..
Keep up the good work and keep us all posted on what you care to share...We are all in this together and it behooves each and every one of us to stick up for our rights and benefits..
As you well know, the Safeway, Vons, Ralphs and Alberstons employees are standing up for their rights and the benefits that they are refusing to give up...I live in a small town that has one Vons store and a couple of small locally owned markets...The people on the picket line are also my friends and neighbors and it is really tough to have to cross their picket line to get to the pharmacy for prescriptions...We drive almost 200 miles on a regular basis to do our shopping in a major city rather than cross their lines...Big corporations care absolutely nothing about their employees any more...We/they are nothing more than numbers on a spreadsheet...As long as the bottom line is in the black, everything is OK..As soon as the bottom line turns red then it is a whole different ballgame...We/they are expendable because there are millions more out there who will do the job for less with few or no benefits...
FYI, I am on salary continuation from Xerox since last summer because I took the opportunity when a VRIF was offered, but was immediately hired back as a "Temp" or "Contract Employee", therefore I have the best of both worlds for a while...I am still privy to the goings on within the company but also am an outsider...Kind of like having one foot in the door and one foot on the golf course...I'm hoping to hold on till the end of this year and then it's "Outta here"...That's why I don't them screwing around with my little Social Security check...
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boatbum ,
glad to see i'm still well received by some :) from " thecse " days . appreciate your sharing with us your on going xerox career . when i am in my district i usually visit the xerox office so maintain a contact too with the current field conditions .
please feel free to express your views here . weither in anger :angry: or in happiness :) . it's the informational sharing that will educate us and help us to plan for the pitfalls that are in front of us durning our retirement . it's the surprises that hurt . especially when you haven't planned for them .
i agree with ARXE when they say , " our discussions with Xerox have been under way since early 2003 . it is the hope of the ASSOCIATION of RETIRED XEROX EMPLOYEES , Inc that the positive relationship that exists with the Corporation is productive in our mission and will continue to grow over time ...........our efforts to date have yielded positive impacts in our discussiojns with Xerox . and it is through the building of the largest group of retired employees that will provide ARXE with the greatest opportunity to further impact the decisions Xerox will be making to affect our benefits . "
more details at : http://www.arxe.org/aboutus.cfm[/url]
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the California Public Employees Retirement System , the nation's largest public pension fund , withheld it's votes for Michael Eisner , Disney's chairman , for re- election to the board .
CalPERS is the 29th single largest shareholder of Disney with 9.9 million shares worth more than $ 235 million depending on the stock price .
p.s. as this story further unfolds these state pension funds join with CalPERS and the California State Teachers Retirement System in voting in a new board for Disney :
1) New York
2) New Jersey
3) Connecticut
4) Massachusetts
5 ) Virginia
p.s.s. the Ohio Public Employees Retiree System has joined the ranks of those to vote against the board .
p.s.s.s. the state of North Carolina public employees retirement system , the Oregon state public employees retirement system , and i just heard on national news that the state of Florida has joined in the vote against the disney board at the meeting tomorrow in the city of philadelphia .
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hi allen and boatbum, i'm over here on the right coast (Taxachusetts), but sharing the same angst. Every year my FICA went up and now that i'm closing in on the holy grail i'm getting very nervous. i'm definetly renewing my AXRE membership
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kilo869 ,
i wouldn't worry much about any big changes happening to social security in this election year . greenspan isn't talking about anything new . alot of people have realized that social security that was designed in the 30's is due for a major overhaul . the least of which reason is that people live so much longer now than in the past . the second reason is that with our lower birth rate there are fewer and fewer worker bees to pay into the system and to support social security retirees . and for the most part people who retired earlier on social security didn't not pay anywhere near what people coming along later have paid into the system . in other words , people who received social security earlier are really getting more out of the system than they ever put into it . generally people older than 65 will get a good deal on social security . people in their late 50's or 60's will break even on their benefits as compared to what they put into the system . and the younger set will LOSE on their social security benefit versis what they put into the system . studies have shown this .
most of the recent changes take into account that people close to social security age will be " grandfathered " in the old regulations . so boatbum , kilo869 , you guys & i should be o.k .
social security is emotional and is called the " third rail " in politics for a good reason . you don't want to touch it . but changes will HAVE to happen gradually to protect the system and benefits for younger employees and future retirees .
p.s. kilo869 , the $ 10 dollars you spend on your ARXE membership is probably the best money you ever invested . and as a member , you realize more than most the work those people are doing to not only protect but also to extend and maybe increase your xerox retiree benefits . we are also fortunate that xerox has honored their commitment for the most part thus far to us as retirees . which is rare in this time of benefits being lost or changed . not sure how much longer any corporation can continue to afford to do that .
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:) Allan,
I'm not really worried about getting cut out of the Social Security loop..I didn't plan my retirement nest egg around Social Security but I would sure like to get back a chunk of what I have paid into the system...I did an up to date and in depth evaluation of what I have paid into the system since my first FICA deduction in 1958...Between my contributions and the contributions of my employers the total is $234,000...I would like to believe that I could recoup some of that before I croak without worrying that the powers that be in DC are going to spend it on something foolish...I started stashing money in an IRA and maxed out my contributions to my 401K a number of years ago because I could see the handwriting on the wall with the Xerox retirement...When they started the mass mailings about "Planning for your Retirement" I knew it wouldn't be long before the cuts started and , lo and behold, I was right...
BTW, when I started paying FICA in 1958 I was working after school in a mens clothing store, making the princely sum of $1.25 an hour...When I started with Xerox in early 1964 I was making $78.50 per week and always had beer money and was driving a new car...Go figure that one out...40 years later I am driving a pickup with over 300K miles and wondering where all the money went...
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boatbum ,
i , too , never figured on getting social security . never figured it in my retirement planning . the numbers show that our age group will just about break even on our social security payment over what we put in the system . . by the way , a 5 % withdrawal rate on $ 235k is about $ 12k a year . which is about what we would get if you purchased a annunity with that lump sum of money of money .
i , too , paid myself first and max'ed out my 401(k) savings and have enough to live the life style of my choice without working . i have more money than i can spend intelligently . used to be i lasted longer than my money . now , my money lasts longer than i do .
i started with xerox in early 1972 and made $ 129 a week and never looked at the jobs ads again or even thought about it . was too busy trying to keep my job and good benefits . golden handcuffs .
chester carlson is probably turning over in his grave with the changes the big X has made to his company and employees . what do ya think ? ?
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chester was very philanthropic, but joe wilson would be rising up out of his grave, he was the only chairman of the board that i didn't personally meet....he died shortly after i was hired.
like you, allen and boatbum, i never planned on ss so anything i get is a bonus, by the way most people i talk to say to start collecting at 62
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kilo869 ,
social security themselves will tell you that it's usually a mistake to wait after age 62 to collect social security . most spreadsheets will show you have to live beyound your late 80's to make the wait worth while .
i look at it as a quality of life issue : " what's the quality of my life going to be at age 80 ? " . i would rather personally collect social security now and enjoy it rather than take a chance i won't live til 80 or give it to a nursing home anyway at that age .
by the way , because you are planning for the worse ( no social security ) , means you should do very well in retirement . cause anything you get is more than you figured and a blessing . attitude is everything :rolleyes:
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:) Allan and kilo,
Gotta' tell you guys a true Joe Wilson story...
Shortly after I hired on as a snot nosed kid right out of Uncle Sams Navy, I was in the branch office when the "high rollers" from Rochester were passing through the Southern Region on a "show the flag tour".
My Mom had just undergone a very serious operation and I was extremely worried about her...As I was walking down the hall toward the mens room I ran face-to-face with Joe Wilson who was headed to the same place..He asked my name and introduced himself as we proceeded in to the facility...He asked about my family and I related to him my concern for my Mom's well being....We finished our business and went our separate ways...
Two years later I was in Rochester attending a class on the "one of a kind" CFP...One day as I was wandering down the hall, once again headed toward the mens room, I rounded a corner and ran head on in to Mr. Wilson...After backing up and apologizing for almost running over me, he called me by name and asked if my Mom had recovered from her surgery two years before...We spoke for over 30 minutes and he had remembered every bit of our conversation that had taken place over two years before...Shortly after that he retired and the torch was passed...
After that encounter I never ever picked up the classifieds or ever considered other employment...I was forunate enough to meet some of the other CEO's but none ever impressed like Joe Wilson...David Kearns was my second favorite and C. Peter was third but everyone else was a mercenary, IMHO...In my court the jury is still out on Anne but I think she is gonna' show more cojones than almost anyone that has come before...I certainly hope I am right on this one...
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boatbum ,
you may be right about anne . so far she has held up pretty well . here is a link for the minutes of a speech she gave in Rochester , N.Y. last april 8th :
http://pages.zdnet.com/tedrunge/id4.html
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the Association of Retired Xerox Employees ( ARXE ) has a new poll on their web site regarding the handling on the future xerox benefits newsletters . i deleted the message on the old poll on the same question . the poll now reads :
1) i am a flex retiree plan retiree and want a common edition sent to all plan retirees - 36.46 %
2) i am a old / new plan retiree and want a common edition sent to all plan retirees - 16.67 %
3) send separate editions of the benefits newsletter to all the different plan retirees - 35.42 %
4) i have no opinion - 11.46 %
more details on their web site : http://www.arxe.org[/url]
poll will stay open awhile so results could change . i voted for a common edition to be sent out again . the poll is supposed to run for awhile so i'll try to give a update every now and then on the vote numbers before they close the poll .
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ARXE has released a update on the RIGP lawsuit settlement :
" the settlement finalized and the third party administrator has been set up . all inquiries should be referred to 1 - 888 - 435 - 6192 , which is the outside administrator for the settlement " .
more details at : http://www.arxe.org[/url] . you MUST be a member to read the full details on this update . they encourage anyone that has any questions at all as to their status involving this lawsuit to call this number .
p.s. as a update on this story , i have a retired xeroid friend who received two letters that indicated he was on the list and he just called the number to find out he in fact is not on the list and there is no money for him as a part of the RIGP lawsuit settlement :( . i have a second friend i called too so i may have a second update to this story . more later .
P.S.S just received a update from my second friend who also received letters in the past naming her as being a part of the lawsuit and she called the number to find out that she is on the list to receive a settlement :rolleyes: . she was told they could not tell her the amount of her check yet but would be in contact with her later this month . so apparently there is some money out there for some people .
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the National Retiree Legislative Network has sent a letter to senator Kerry and joins the Ad Hoc Coalition to restore Retirement Security . more details on their web site : http://www.nrln.org
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to readers of this forum ,
i would like to call your attention to the " more out the door " topic under " the cse coffee house " forum . there are some union issues that may be of interest to this readership . as i've already said on that topic , this may be the only place on the web where this kind of information can be accessed and shared .
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would also like to call attention to the readers of this forum about another tech looking for a job on the " technicans seeking employment " forum on this site . thanks again to xertech.org for setting the enviroment for this to happen . :D . hopefully a employer that reads this forum will get in touch with john .
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Association of Retired Xerox Employees sent me a e - mail notification of 60 days notice of my membership dues . i was wondering how their membership renewal was going to work . the e - mail gives their mailing address and the fee is the same $ 10 . best ten bucks i ever spent .
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this story intrugues me because i cashed out on my retirement, and am eligeble for health care on my new job, but i keep the xerox plan for when i turn 65 (4 years). i hope it will still be there
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kilo869,
i hope it will be there too . the trend ( fewer and fewer companies offer health care for retirees every year because of the costs and the rate of increase in the cost of those benefits ) as i've reported here is to reduce retiree benefits including health care . especially post - 65 health care because medicare already provides coverage for that age group . as one of my fellow xerox retiree friends says , " we'll see next year " . health care costs can bankrupt a company . especially as you have fewer and fewer CURRENT employees and more and more RETIREES at higher costs .
one of the reasons i feel this forum is so important is because of the information it provides for retirement planning for benefits such as health care . if one realizes that other companies are going out of business attempting to provide health care for retirees , then you're more likely to accept changes in those benefits instead of taking a chance of LOSING them entirely . this is why it is so terribily important the work that A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) is doing for us trying to maintain our benefits . and they state that mission in the very first sentence of their web page : " the escalating retiree costs and changes that have been made to our retiree healthcare benefits prompted a group of Xerox retirees to band together with the hope of adding a strong retiree voice to the Coporate decision processes and provide a positive impact to our Medical Plan benefits " . more details at : http://www.arxe.org
and of course , part of that change could be NO retiree health care coverage from xerox and if you're prepared due to your retirement planning , you can obtain coverage elsewhere and be able to afford it because you've planned for it .
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i just received my " Investing for your future - News and views about the Xerox Savings Plans " . this is the no.37 - february 2004 issue that has the xerox 401(k) performance through the periods ending december 31st , 2003 . the main topic of this issue is the bond funds . one point that i found interesting was that xerox has changed the asset allocation for the Xerox Pension Plan . the stock asset allocation has been reduced from 70% to 64% . xerox has allocated 5% of the pension fund to real estate and 1% to the absolute return strategy .
i remember in days of ole when the old " general fund " had a real estate component . looks like we are returning to those days .
the balanced fund - more stocks , a core 401(k) plans choice , continues to have a 70% allocation to stocks . as a result , the performance of the balanced fund - more stocks NO LONGER MIRRORS the performance of the xerox pension fund .
this issue suggests using the finanical engines available to learn more about bonds . more information at : http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox . of course this site is only available if you have funds still with the xerox 401(k) .
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just received a e - mail from Don Monefeldt , the membership chairman of A.R.X.E. , confirming my membership fee was received . they thanked me for my continued support and that i found my membership a worthwhile investment . which i definitely do . i still have the cheapest medical plan payment of any of my retired friends . and more choices . some of my friends have NO retiree medical coverage or only one single choice .
more details on joining at http://www.arxe.org
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i have been following this legislation ( please see my posts of december 9th on page 2 , january 26th on page 3 , and february 2nd on page 4 ) : http://suite101.com/print_message.cfm/inve...ng/86836/936401[/url]
i , too , have a interest in pension law and the impact this will have on us as retirees . and it looks like congress is getting ready to move even though this is a election year . stay tuned .
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the Association of Retired Xerox Employees has posted a bulletin of RIGP Notification Letters being mailed . A.R.X.E. says they will continue to post information as it becomes available but that this " MATTER IS COMING TO A CLOSE QUICKLY " . if you have any questions , please call the Berger Pension Settlement Center directly at : 1 - 888 - 435 - 6192 or go to http://www.arxe.org[/url] for further details . A.R.X.E. has a extensive section on their web site on this issue . you must be a member to visit this entire site . you can join on line . you might want to consider joining BEFORE we lose our retiree benefits and not AFTER we lose our retiree benefits ...................if that happens .
for those of you with questions as to your status on the RIGP lawsuit , " speak now or forever hold your peace " . :rolleyes:
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the I.R.S. deadline is april 1st ( this thursday ) if you will be 70 1/2 this year for the first ( of hopefully many ) of your required minimum distributions . formulas and more details are available at : http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p590.pdf . this is publication 590 and is the bible for retirees . the latest edition is for tax year 2003 and should be a part of your reference library . get one every year cause they change .
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xerox just issued a bulletin on the hewitt web site http://www.resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url] that ESOP Dividend checks will be sent out march 30th for those with balances still available . you can go on line and see the amount of the check you will be getting . in my case , it was two separate checks .
you must still have funds in your xerox 401(k) to be able to log on to this site .
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i have a personal comment about the RIGP lawsuit . out of many friends who are xeroids and retired , i had two who were originally named in the lawsuit . one of those individuals called the number to find out that although he received several letters that said he was a part of the suit , that he in fact was not and there was no money for him in the settlement .
the second person that received a letter that also named them as being in the lawsuit , called the number and was told they were in fact part of the settlement and would be hearing from them shortly . that person just heard and was told that in fact there was no money available for them as a part of the settlement although there was some monies coming to them as a part of their ESOP settlement calculation .
i will release further information as it becomes available . if in doult about your own status , call the toll free number : 1 - 888 - 435 - 6192 . as A.R.X.E comments , " this matter is coming to a close quickly " .
for further details see the additional posts regarding this suit of :
march 28th on page 7
march 11th on page 6
march 2nd on page 6
february 8th on page 4
december 19th on page 2
november 24th on page 1
all on this forum . enjoy .
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hi allen,
just sent in my second quarter health insurance premium, i hate writing the check but it's still a bargain, and i don't want it to expire.
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kilo869 ,
i don't want to miss my quarterly payment so bad , i wrote them a check , in full , for the entire year's amount and send them alittle note along with it asking them to accept it please cause i'm concerned about my life style ( snow bird ) between alaska & hawaii would cause me to miss a billing and thus a payment .
so far , for the last three years , they have acccepted it and i never see a bill the rest of the year . i send it certified mail - return receipt . once a year and i'm done . no worry about losing coverage .
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Congressional Quarterly reports that H R 3108 went into conference on 3/9/04 . the next step is usually on to the president for his signature . the last post on this legislation is on march 23 on page 7 . this post also mentions prior posts concerning this bill if you want more details on the effects of the bill . among other things , the amount of a lump sum settlement that a person would receive would be SMALLER than in the past . it'll be interesting to see how much smaller after the new lump sum calculations happen with this new legislation .
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i'm going to introduce readers of this forum to the more complex issues that affect us as retirees . the article and the author of this article , John Mauldin , doesn't mean that i agree with the author or the article . but i do feel it's important to be well read on these issues cause we , as retirees , will certainly be a part of it in some fashion or other . the link is : http://www.2000wave.com/article.asp?id=mwo040204[/url]
this author can be long winded and it's perfectly acceptable to skip the latter parts of the article about RECESSION , ECHO BUBBLE , etc . but the issues that outline the problems in the first part of the article give us a idea of what we as a nation must face in the end . and as you can read , other countries are further down the track than we are and face the same problems .
none of this is meant to be investment advice . or meant to agree or disagree with the issues outlined in this article . just food for thought . after all , being retired , we have more time :) to solve the world's problems . i hope you will enjoy this article . i may do more of the same in the future .
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in retirement the goals are not only to grow your money , but also how to invest it so that it lasts your life time . and how to withdraw it . to that end , here is a article worth reading :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...ng/13785/942945[/url]
please keep in mind that none of these articles or links are meant to be investment advice but meant to be food for thought . please consult a finanical advisor of your choice . IT'S YOUR MONEY .
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more on pensions :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...ng/86836/945152[/url]
and unlike the author , Austrian , of this e - mail , this will NOT be my last post on these issues . :) . stay tuned .
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apparently there is also a fifth version of H.R.3108 . it is H.R.3108.ENR , which is a Enrolled as agreed to or passed by both House and Senate .
it's going to take awhile for the national press to fully explain this legislation . i have several links but they are all in legalese and NOT in plain engliish so aren't any good as to the impact of this bill . i'll do more research and see if i can't find links that better explain the effects of this bill . for starters , you can expect LOWER lump sum payouts than in the past BEFORE this bill was passed . stay tuned .
p.s. i just recently added the link to the post above so you can start there if you want to research this on your own . google also gives alot of other sources .
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the Association of Retired Xerox Employees has put out a bulletin that their site has been deluged for several weeks now by the Netsky Worm . they report that they have managed to keep it out of their system , but urge their members to use several free tools available on their site to check their own systems . i won't give their web site link on this post to allow their site some relief . members who have business over there are already plugged in .
i run Norton Virus myself and update it automaticly so most , if not all , of my e - mails should be safe . but , of course , you never know . i also use Compuserve as my internet service provider and they do a pretty good job of keeping their site and my e - mail and attachments clean . hopefully :blink:
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the Association of Retired Xerox Employees announced their first anniversity . they have 1,650+ members at this time . but , with over 22,000 + u.s. xerox retirees , ARXE realizes they have a ways to go .
A.R.X.E. feels good about their accomplishments and looks forward to the future . you can join on line at : http://www.arxe.org[/url]
help them to support you to maintain your retiree benefits
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for those of you looking at retiring in a different state or wanting to compare your state's tax burden with other's might enjoy this link .
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...ng/13785/946563[/url]
i live in alaska as my primary residence and can agree that the state's tax structure is very low . it's just the weather and winters that wear on ya in alaska . and although i spend the rest of my year in hawaii , i don't find their tax structure ( which is high ) as burden some because i don't pay state income taxes on my retiree income in hawaii .
however i do find that both states ( alaska & hawaii ) have a similar ( items at costco in each state are almost the same prices ) and both have a very high cost of living .
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i found another link for pension benefit issues :
http://www.afponline.org[/url]
this is the Committee on Investment of Employee Benefit Assets or CIEBA . their web site has several links to articles on pension issues .
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hi allen,
i read the interview, and like you, was really set on my heels, i wonder if many other retirees read that and thought again about investing $10..... i would hate to see push come to shove on this issue
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the xerox 401(k) web site with hewitt http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url] has announced the closing of the BGI ( Barclays Global Investors ) Asset Allocation fund in the other marketplace window . more details on the site . of course , you xeroids realize that you must have a account to be able to log on .
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hi allen,
i know that health will increase, and am willing to accept that. my wife and i both have other health care available until retirement if needed, but after that who knows. i'm hoping that xerox will still be there, especially post-65, but if it isn't who can predict the cost of supplemental insurance. i think the a.r.x.e. statement best summarizes my thoughts.
now....about getting blood from a turnip
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kilo869 ,
actually the part available to us now , " the post - 65 coverage " , is probably the MOST likely to be terminated because medicare already offers it to us . in other words , it is a duplicate . i was willing to accept the increases in the past when xerox offered the post - 65 coverage . medicare is a real mess when you study it .
your comment " after that who knows " is going to be the future . my xeroid retired friends think that we are on a year - to - year status with our health care . beyond that your statement , " who knows " , rules . makes our A.R.X.E. membership a real investment . and future federal legislation more important .
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to those that are interested , the " more out the door " topic in the " CSE Coffee House " forum has taken on a life of it's own . the numbers are adding up :( . check out that area and bring us all up to date on your region .
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just received a personal e - mail from jfs entitled " taxes " . it said , " come on allen , your not getting anything back that wasn't yours to start with . the idea of the game is see how much you get to keep " .
and i replied back to jfs that of course he's correct . i was just happy to finally have paid enough to the feds in my quarterly statements that i was happy to get even my own money back . with the benefits of the turbo tax software , i'm getting better at managing my tax brackets . of course i won't pay as much in the future because i over paid this year .
i'm finding in retirement that the biggest payment i make is to the i.r.s. and that tax management can really save ya real bucks . even if it is your own money :D . to give you an idea of what i'm talking about , in the last five years since i've been using turbotax , my EFFECTIVE tax rate has moved from 22.44% to 14.64% . the effective tax rate is the rate one pays on EVERY dollar earned . just as the MARGINAL tax rate is the rate one pays on the LAST dollar earned .
and this is all in response to a post of mine on april 15th about getting a large refund back .
p.s. as a follow up to this i just got kicked back my reply sent to jfs at his aol e - mail address ? ? so i'm glad jfs can read my reply here too :)
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received a personal e - mail from hectorpuppy entitled , " the cse.com " . it was his opinion of xerox and without going into full detail it had in it , " Understand , i am not bashing Xerox , ( but i'm going to anyway ) " . and ended up with , " Well i guess i've vented yea i'm done " .
my reply was that i couldn't argue with him about his opinion of xerox , but that i had many good memories and xerox fed my family and provided me with a career with a good retirement now .
duanew has started a forum here , " General Discussion , Humor , Rants , etc " , that is a excellent platform for these discussions .
and here is a good place to say that if any of ya'll send me a personal e - mail , i will also respond on my forum UNLESS you ask me not to do so . i feel a OPEN discussion is educational for everyone . as long as it " doesn't scare the horses " , i have no objection to reading and talking about these / those issues .
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hi allen,
definetly not good news, we care for my wife's parents and if it wasn't for supplemental insurance there would be a lot more out-of -pocket or much less care and presriptions
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kilo869 ,
i'm afarid there will be alittle of both in the future : more out of pocket & alittle less care . or certainly one will have to consider their options in the future .
for myself , i've opted to pay for the highest deductable plan and make more of the decisions for myself and just be covered for the major things .
one of the priorities in retirement planning is after you've gotten together a sum necessary to retire ( called critical mass ) is to FOCUS on your health . cause without that , the rest is questionable .
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A.R.X.E. ( Association of Retired Xerox Employees ) http://www.arxe.org[/url] issued a bulletin on the decision from the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission . see the link above .
A.R.X.E. suggests going to their ( " Legislation " navigation page and use Congressional access links to your Congressional representives ) .
you must be a member to access all of this site . if you aren't a member , you might think about joining while there is time to affect a change . cause the trend doesn't look good right now .
if you can't join A.R.X.E. cause you aren't qualified then consider joining the National Retiree Legislative Network http://www.nrln.org[/url] . they now offer individual memberships .
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more on the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission's decision to let companies reduce health care to medicare retirees . this is their offical press release on their web site : http://www.eeoc.gov/press/4-22-04a.html[/url]
sure sounds like govermental mumbo jumbo to me :blink: national news is giving pretty good coverage on this issue today too .
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United Health Group aquires Oxford Health Plans in a $ 4.9 to $ 5.0 billion dollar deal . http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=unh[/url] gives several links as to the savings and benefits of this .
on a personal note , i have united health care and have been happy with it so far . and xerox ONLY offers health care post - 65 coverage through United Health Care ..............for now .
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here's a link for the latest studies on health care costs for retirees : http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/103455/955070[/url]
of course , regulars readers on this forum aren't surprised at this information . stay tuned .
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A.R.X.E http://www.arxe.org[/url] has released more information on the Berger lawsuit . after filling out the Berger Pension Class Action Settlement Response Form it will take time to determine the recipient's eligibility and then 90 days to issue a check . given this information , it is unlikely that checks will be issued before the end of june for those applications received in march .
more information on A.R.X.E's web site . or call 1 - 888 - 435 - 6192 if you have any questions regarding your status in this suit .
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A.R.X.E. http://www.arxe.org[/url] released a e - mail reply from Anne Mulcahy to one of A.R.X.E.'s members in response to the interview in the Rochester Democrat and Chronicle about health care benefits for retirees .
when A.R.X.E. issued the article about the interview , they also provided a e - mail link to Anne . it looks like the membership of A.R.X.E. sent Anne e - mails about her comments . in the reply it was stated that there are presently 1.3 active employees for every retiree and that ratio is dropping . the e - mail reply is long and should be read by all xerox retirees . e - mail reply from Anne mentions that the xerox new hires AFTER 2003 will have to pay the FULL cost of their retiree health care coverage . and that health care costs are a national problem and not just a xerox problem . ends with the statement that the Retiree Flex newsletter will be sent out shortly to participants . future news on our retiree health care benefits ? ? .
the A.R.X.E. has been having difficultly with their e - mail system and all members may not be aware of this yet . stay tuned .
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i hope that they don't raise the price of Paxil
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i hope kilo869 , for all our mental stability , they don't either .
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the association of xerox retired employees http://www.arxe.org[/url] released their 2003 Annual Report along with their 2003 Finanicals in preparation for their 2004 Annual Meeting to be held june 10th to be held at the Country Party House located at 321 East Lindin Avenue , East Rochester , N.Y. more details on their web site .
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i just received in the mail today my copy of the 2003 Investment Funds Annual Report on the Xerox 401(k) Savings Plans . to those of you who are retired and have not been receiving your annual copy like you did when you were a current employee , you can contact xerox / hewitt and put yourself back on the mailing list .
this is valuable information . as a example , i noticed that the Income fund has increased their asset allocation of high yield ( junk ) bonds from zero percent in 2002 to 14 % last year ( 2003 ) . so i certainly don't need any junk bonds in the rest of my portfolio .
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just got off the phone with hewitt / xerox to take my remaining xerox ESOP shares as stock certificates and the rep encouraged me to do the transaction on line . and i did and it was painless . i will receive the stock certificates to take down to my local broker's office to deposit in my personal account to deal with later . hopefully at a higher price later . ;)
the rep also informed me that i would receive one more additional dividend check next year but that this transaction would close out my ESOP account which was my intent .
i also found out that if i was taking a distribution from my 401(k) , that i could in fact stop that withdrawal and roll over the remainder of my 401(k) into a i.r.a. i thought once you began to take distributions from your 401(k) , you could never roll it over to a i.r.a. later .
thanked the rep for hewitt's service . durning my transition from employment to retirement , i always heard the same thing from hewitt , no matter whch rep i talked to . and after dealng with xerox human resources , that was comforting .
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A.R.X.E. , association of retired xerox employees , has released on their web site http://www.arxe.org[/url] the May employee benefit newsletter . it's a 16 page newsletter and full of new information . among other things it details the current costs and factors regarding the retiree health care and changes planned for the future . " due to the extent of the changes coming , you will be required to ACTIVELY ENROLL for your 2005 benefits OR BE DEFAULTED to a level of coverage that may not meet your needs " . it encourages people that enrollment in the future will be even more important and that there will additional information in the future . the newsletter gos into great detail on the effects of the new laws on drug coverage and medicare .
newsletter gos on to say there will be a different newsletter going out to other medical plan retirees . this newsletter is for the FLEX plan people . stay tuned .
there was also a link for a e - mail address for suggestions and questions for future newsletters . i gave them my input ? ? <_<
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Hi Al, in regard to the ESOPs, ESOPs have been paying an annual dividend with a guaranteed base price. If the place goes belly up, ESOPs will be payed before common shares. I am going to hang on to my ESOPs as long as I can. Remember what Tonto say,ESOP good,options bad. jfs
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ifs ,
you're correct that ESOP shares pay a dividend now . but they DID NOT in the recent past and xerox just started paying the dividend again . just as xerox USED to pay a dividend on their common shares and now they no longer do . so weither xerox continues the dividend is at question .
weither a dividend fits your investment strategy is up to each individual investor . at this time holding xerox common shares in my personal account for sale later and paying a lower ( 15 % or less depending on your tax bracket ) capital gains rates on my profit fits my individual investment plan . keep in mind that all funds coming out of a 401(k) are taxed as normal income .
am i buying more xerox shares cause i think they are a good investment ? ? NO . but i can obtain six xerox common shares for a cost basis of $ 13.05 a share for each one of my ESOP shares so that's the route i went .
different courses for different horses . you makes your bets and you play your hand as you see'em . thanks for the input though cause your strategy isn't bad either . :rolleyes:
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any of ya interested in finding a job ? ? looks like another technican found a job on the " technicans seeking employment " forum . put up your location and get a reply .
any of ya interested in hiring ? ? put your request for a tec on our " employment seeking technicans " forum .
thanks to xertech for providing this service . :)
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A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) decided to cancel their membership in the N.R.L.N. ( national retiree legislative network ) due to a dues increase from $ 2 per person to $ 5 per person . A.R.X.E. decided the increase wasn't worth the increase . at the present 1,700 members ( 5/17/2004 and growing ) that would be $ 8,500 a year versus $ 3,400 a year .
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hi allen,
just got my you and xerox for retirees.......doesn't look good, but doesn't look that bad either. page 4 looks interesting, wish they had more info.
kilo
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sorry about my lateness in getting back to you kilo , but i've been absent from the net and this board until now . and i also have not received my copy of " you and xerox for retirees " yet so i can't comment on your own observations yet . but i will comment when i get my own hard copy of the issue in question and can study it .
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ARXE http://www.arxe.org[/url] released the above two articles on their web site . i ran down the links and posted them in the above two posts for those of you who haven't joined yet . further details are available on the ARXE web site for members .
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xerox announces the june 30th deadline for ALL medical claims submissions for 2003 . more details at : http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url]
of course , you must have a account with xerox / hewitt in order to access this web site .
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kilo869 ,
i finally received my hard copy of the may , 2004 issue of the You & Xerox - benefit news for xerox retirees and can comment on your post of may 19th now . and you're right , page four which is about " Looking Ahead : What to Expect in 2005 " is interesting . mentions " transitioning .......based on a coinsurance model , new choices , continued increases " , and " we'll communicate the details of these changes in advance of , and during annual enrollment " .
also mentions " due to the extent of the changes coming , you will be required to ACTIVELY ROLL for your 2005 benefits OR BE DEFAULTED to a level of coverage that may not meet your needs " .
needless to say , our " active participation in the 2005 annual enrollment process is very important . please stay tuned for more details in the future " .
and it also looks like kilo869 that Paxil will continue to be covered but they suggest that you look at Alprazolam or Paroxetine HCL as a generic substitute . but Fluoxetine seems to be the cheapest . :) . and then again Wellbutrin SR might be worth the extra money ? ? .
and lastly i found of interest xerox's comments regarding the " Medicare Prescription Drug , Improvement and Modernization Act of 2003 " on page 12 . xerox said , " further information will be provided after decisions are finalized - most likely in 2005 " .
by the way i have a friend who has a domestic pardner who is considering her medicare options and she is finding out that her doctor will NOT accept her business in the future under medicare . there are serious problems with medicare and i suggest you research your options BEFORE you give up your medical coverage with xerox . some of those decisions are a " one way street " and you DO NOT get to change your mind and make them again . and if they do allow you a " one time change " , you really are locked into that decision then .
and on page 13 xerox mentioned Health Savings Accounts ( HSAs ) , " the Company is currently evaluating these accounts " and " Xerox does not currently offer a plan that would qualify you to purchase an HSA , but may decide to do so in the future " . and on page 15 we can expect to being able to pay monthly instead of the present quarterly billing cycle and do so on line . people can expect to see these changes with the next scheduled billing cycle in june .
all in all , kilo869 , " the times they are a changing " .
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i received a phone call today from a tech rep who is currently employed and he said that he spoke with hewitt and that xerox switched the ESOP shares to COMMON shares last friday . in going into the xerox 401(k) web site http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url] the ESOP account does in fact show up now as " common shares " .
i received the last of my ESOP shares as a common share certificate in the mail today so my account shows a zero balance anyway . i'll run down to my brokerage office in the morning and have them deposited in my personal account . my last conversation with hewitt was that those of us who held ESOP shares this year would receive a final distribution of dividends next year .
p.s. the e - mail exchange that i had with ifs on may 12th about him keeping his ESOP shares to receive a dividend and have a floor value on those shares may be a mute point now . if you're going to hold common shares , you just as well hold them in a personal brokerage account where you can receive long term capital gains treatment when you sell them . because if you sell them out of your 401(k) , everything coming out of a deferred account is ordinary income and taxed as income .
p.s.s. as a update on this converting xerox ESOP shares to COMMON shares in your 401(k) account , another retired xeroid friend of mine received a letter in today's mail that informed him that xerox was going to convert his ESOP shares at $ 13.04 a share to common shares .
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dave coriale , chairman of the association of retired xerox employees , sent a letter thanking the democrat & chronicle for their coverage in the articles i linked in my posts of may 25th .
further details on http://www.arxe.org
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Hey Al,
It looks like our ESOPs are in the same boat with our healthcare,sailing off into the sunset.
jfs
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looks like you are correct ifs . i'm going to withhold full judgement until i see our medical costs for our medical coverage for next year ( 2005 ) and our choices . inspite of xerox increasing their costs to the extent they have , i still pay one half to one fourth what my retired friends pay for retiree medical coverage with other companies . in other words they pay twice to four times what i pay for their retiree health care coverage , if they have it at all , and don't have the choices i do . and i still feel that my retiree health care is still the best benefit i received when i left xerox . not sure how much longer i'm going to be able to say that . :( . make's kilo869's Paxil perscription more important in the future . :) .
as for the ESOP 's turning into common shares , i took all my esop shares as common shares anyway so that didn't have a affect on me .
but your point about our benefits sailing away is correct . and unfortunately that is the trend as i've reported in my posts . i feel we have to attempt to hold the line or we'll have NO retiree health care coverage and membership in A.R.X.E. is one of the best ways to achieve that goal i think .
appreciate your input . :)
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just returned from my local brokerage office where i deposited the xerox common stock certificate i received in the mail yesterday from Equiserve . there was a place on the back side of the certificate for me to sign and i was told those shares would show up in my personal account at the close of business today . now when i sell these shares later i am subject only to capital gains rates , 15 % or less , instead of income tax bracket rates , which could be 35 % or more on those gains if the stock price ( ? ) gos up .
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hi allen,
glad we're still in agreement about healthcare, you know when they're going to online monthly payments the premiums are going up (takes the sting out).
i'm also glad that you mentioned the medicare turndown. DO NOT GIVE UP THE POST-65 COVERAGE. sorry to yell but that's how important i feel it is. and, yes, the premiums are high but it's still the best deal in town, and if i have to pay more to keep it i will (won't like it, but i'll do it).
for God's sake, stay healthy,
kilo869
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kilo869 ,
sorry about my delay in getting back to you but i was absent from the wide world of wait and this board until now on personal business .
you are ABSOLUTELY CORRECT about not giving up the POST - 65 COVERAGE when one has that choice . the number of doctors and clinics taking social security / medicare patients is declining . the situation is so bad that medicare card people obtain their care by going the the emergency side of the hospital and wait until some one can see them . and because it's not critical , as with most patients that come through the emergency door , they sometimes wait for hours . medicare does not pay anywhere near the true cost of the benefit and doctors / clinics don't want to take them as clients .
and you're also right that after one has achieved enough money to retire in the life style of their choice ( critical mass ) , health should be their next priority . also agree with you that i'm not happy with the increasing prices , but it's still the best deal in town .
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Allan,
I agree with you 110% that our coverage is the best deal in town and I will give you a "for instance" that will verify that opinion...
On 14 May my wife underwent almost 14 hours of surgery at the UCLA Medical Center to remove and reconstruct both of her breasts due to a diagnosis of DCIS (ductile carcinoma in situ)...In laymans terms. breast cancer, but not invasive....She received this diagnosis last November after her annual mammogram and a needle biopsy...
Thanks to her medical background as an RN and our contacts in the medical community we were able to shop for the best available care for her...We found that the top two hospitals in the country for this procedure are UCLA and NYU...Of course, living in LaLaLand, we checked out and chose UCLA and the great group of surgeons they have at the UCLA/Revlon Breast Center...
We carry the Blue Cross, Blue Shield option as our medical insurance...The bills have started to hit the insurance website and so far they have reached almost $200K...Our total out of pocket has been $320.00...That's right, three hundred twenty dollars, total....If that's not the best deal in town I'll kiss your every butt and every other butt on the flight deck...
In a scenario like this the premiums we pay are a mere drop in the bucket compared to the charges that are incurred...I agree that the cost of medical care is outrageous but none of us can afford to be without the coverage that is available to us...
BTW, the surgery was a complete success and the sweet lady that stuck by me through all the years of ups and downs with X is still by my side and will be for the long haul...
To all of you on this board, PLEASE,PLEASE,PLEASE, if you are female, have an annual mammogram, and if you are male, encourage your wives or significant others to do the same....If it were not for Pat's annual mammogram her outcome could have been a lot different....We will both be running in the 5 and 10K's this year in the "Search for the Cure"...
Boatbum
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boatbum ,
i really appreciate your sharing your personal story with us . i feel that by sharing this personal data we all benefit by that knowledge . i know several xeroids that have similar experiences as yours with similar numbers and the amount of the bills that were paid for them by having the xerox health care coverage MORE than made up for any additional increases they may face in the future .
my ex - boss had $ 35k worth of heart surgery putting in a stent in a over nite stay and only paid a few hundred dollars and he said to me that the future costs of his health care was more than paid for in that one procedure .
another xeroid friend had over $ 30k of prostrate surgery for cancer and $ 15k in radiation treatments with similar small costs out of his pocket . needless to say he isn't concerned about future health care costs too .
i have stated , and will continue to state , that my retiree health care coverage with xerox is my best benefit . i enjoyed my career . enjoyed the work until the last few years when i became too old to change . and my lump sum i got was generous . and i never had to even look at the " work ads " in the paper for all those years like some of my friends . and ALL of my retired friends that have health care coverage through other carriers pay twice to four times what i pay and DO NOT have the choices i have .
glad to hear your " sweet lady " will be there in the future :) . i remember mine keeping my dinner warm for me all those years when i had to work after hours fixing that machine so the customer would find a functional machine the next morning and i wasn't thoughtful enough to call my wife and let her know i would be late . i fell asleep more than once with my face in my dinner plate .
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Hi BoatBum
last year i lost my brother- in-law to pancreatic ca and the cost for his treatment at Mass. General Hospital would have been overwhelming if not for insurance, like you i'm married to an RN so she knows the program here in the Boston area, and yes she has an annual boob-a-scope.
tomorrow we'll be in the Relay for Life, which is becoming an annual affair for us
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for those of you fortunate enough to be retired and managing your own pension with your lump sum , don't forget to make your second quarterly estimated tax payment by next tuesday june 15th . i've made a few quarterly payments alittle late occassionly and have never paid or been charged a extra fee . but it's easier to just pay on time .
more details at :
http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p505.pdf[/url]
this is the Tax Withholding and Estimated Tax Publication .
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when you log on to the matterofchoice web site http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] there is a pop - up that says :
Question of the Month
q . when is the next billing cycle ?
a . the mail date for your retiree invoice has been changed . you will receive your invoice on or about July 1st .
this web site is available to retirees any time , not just during open enrollment .
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pension pain
http://www.mises.org/fullstory.asp?control=1545[/url]
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long term health care costs :
http://www.nytimes.com/2004/06/21/health/21HEAL.html[/url]
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score one for the other side kilo869 :( . HMOs win Supreme Court case .
http://wid.ap.org/documents/scotus/040621aetna.pdf[/url]
the court ruled that patients who claim their HMOs wouldn't pay for recommended medical care CAN NOT sue for big malpractice damages .
this case will easily be extended to corporate health care benefits , not just HMOs . my Paxil prescription ran out kilo869 , you got some left ? ? :blink:
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the Supreme Court ruling recently is now being picked up by the national press and more details are coming out . and as they say , " this is a big deal " . it looks like recourse through the courts is pretty much gone if you have a dispute with your health care provider because the damages would be limited to the cost of a particular medical test , a few hundred dollars maybe . certainly makes following your individual provider's instructions on your coverage more important . cause you're not going to be able to deal with the issue through the courts or even threaten to do so . puts more pressure on hospitals and doctors on their options for your best care .
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can't afford Paxil Allen, how 'bout some Alprozolam? Better yet, Johnnie Walker Red.
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just got a letter from Caremark, Prilosec co-pay is going up.....got to go generic
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Kilo.
:rolleyes: We have found that buying Prilosec at Costco is almost as cheap as the co-pay...
No matter what happens in the future, I am glad I have the Blue Shield option now...The bills keep hitting the insurance website for my wife's recent breast cancer surgery and they have almost hit $200K and they are still not all on the site...
Kinda' put our plans to move to Florida on the back burner for the time being but we are still planning to make the move after the first of the year...Maybe you and Mrs Kilo can stop by and see us on the way down to your inlaws place...Would love to meet you folks, shoot the breeze, see who can tell the biggest lies about the Tech Rep days and go out on the boat for some fun and sun...
Boatbum
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kilo869 ,
sorry about the delay in getting back to ya , but i was away from the wide world of wait and this forum for a few days . Johnnie Walker Red sounds o.k. but i'm more of a wine person myself .
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the Association of Retired Xerox Employees has announced on their web site that the billing process for the Flex Plan has been changed and beginning now this plan has been implimented .
mailings are just being sent out reflecting this change and providing information on payment options . more details at http://www.arxe.org
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A.R.X.E. attended the Xerox Annual Meeting may 20th and following the meeting had a private meeting with Pat Nazemetz , V.P. of Human Resources , and Larry Becker , Director of Employee Benefits about A.R.X.E.'s concerns regarding retiree benefits .
there will be a follow on meeting with Pat Nazemetz in Stamford in mid - July . more details on A.R.X.E.'s web site . the battle has begun for next year's benefit package costs .
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hi boatbum,
sounds great although folks aren't doing well so don't know if they'll make the florida trip this year. we'll have to work on getting allen over to the right coast
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appreciate your invite kilo869 . and if i ever make it to the " right " coast i would definitely let you know . right now with alaska ( now ) in the summer and hawaii ( later ) in the winter , i'm about traveled out .
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there is a new question of the month on the matterofchoice web site http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] . this new pop - up says :
Q. has there been a change to the process for how i pay for my retiree health care ?
A . Yes . beginning with the July 1st billing , the process has changed to a monthly cycle . the amount due will be for one month and you will receive a new invoice every month . to whom you make your check payable and where your check need to be mailed as well . be sure to review your invoice carefully .
this site is available to retirees year round and not just durning the open enrollment period in the fall of every year . now that the billing cycle is every month , it's to your benefit to keep up with your billing for health care . in the past , you only had to worry about four bills a year . now , you can get behind in just one month if you miss a billing cycle .
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xerox / hewitt 401(k) web site http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url] has announced the xerox 401(k) savings plan data is available for QUICKEN download . quicken finanical planning software people will be happy to hear this . more information on the site .
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A.R.X.E. announced that they had received many inquiries regarding the change in the Flex Plan billing cycle . X.R.X.E. forwarded these concerns to the Xerox Benefit Office , and received the following information to help clarify the change .
beginning in july , xerox is initiating a monthly billing cycle . the initial mailings for the july payment weren't sent until late june and some did not receive them until the end of the month ( june ) . subsequent billing mailings will be sent out approximately 25 days in advance of the due date , and there will be a 60 day grace period for each payment .
the concerns being raised about cancellation of coverage statements in the accompanying letter should be tempered by the fact that the grace period is two momths and is similar to the policy that has existed in the past . if a account is long overdue , the retiree will get a notification and will be provided information on what actions need to be taken to correct the problem .
sometime in the next two months , an auto - pay process will be initiated to facilitate automatic deductions from a banking institution or a credit card on a monthly basis . in addition , there will be provisions made to permit payments for multiple months for those interested in prepaying larger amounts .
more details on this matter at : http://www.arxe.org[/url]
my personal experience is that i received a statement today in the mail . the good news is the invoice amount is correct :) . the bad news is that i had already paid for my entire year's health coverage in january and shouldn't have received a bill :( . i sent them a certified return receipt letter today with all my documentation such as canceled checks and certified return receipts so i expect that it should be cleared up in short order . i am very pleased to see that xerox has followed up on my request , and others i'm sure , to allow retirees to prepay for multiple months and / or have the payment deducted from a bank or credit card account automaticly in the future .
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A.R.X.E. has released information on a new e - mail site to help focus on benefits - related information to retirees . this site is not for questions related to your personal circumstances . you must still use the benefits center at 1 - 888 - 979 - 9961 for those questions .
the e - mail address is : XRBenefitNewsInput@hewitt.com
this e - mail address is for those questions you would like to see addressed in future retiree newsletters . in my personal experience , several months ago i requested ( and i'm sure others too ) that xerox address those who wanted to pre - pay their health care coverage in advance . and it looks like xerox is going to allow that in their new on - line health care billing system in the future . :)
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i just received a phone call from ADP Benefit Services that handles our ( xerox ) health care coverage payments . they acknowledged that i am paid up for the full year of 2004 : ( see my post of july 1st of this year on this forum and topic ) .
i asked them about being able to prepay in the future for 2005 and was told that there would be that option ( see the last part of my post above ) . and that if i did prepay for a entire year , i would continue to receive a invoice every month along with everyone alse , but my invoice would show zero balance owed .
so there are changes coming . now if they can just keep the cost ( i already know there's going to be increases ) increases down . expect to hear from A.R.X.E. ( Association of Retired Xerox Employees http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) shortly about their meeting going on right now ( mid july - see my post of june 29th of this year on this forum and topic ) in stamford with the big X about our health care costs for 2005 .
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hi allen and boatbum,
was talking to an old bud (retired, but not Xeroid), i told him that i registered with the v.a. (he's a vet), but i'm not sure why i did, my classification is so low, any input from you tired old vets?
signed,
the proud, the few,
U.S.A.F. and Xerox
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Kilo,
Registering with the VA is a very smart move....
One of my sailing buddies who has his boat on the same dock as mine is a retired Teamster...Although his pension is paid by the Teamsters Union, his health care was to be paid by the company that he drove for, for almost 30 years...Two years after he retired his old employer went non-union and all of his health care coverage disappeared and there was not a damned thing he could do about it...Being an ex Special Forces type, he went right down and registered with the VA and now all of his medical needs are met by Uncle Sugar...He doesn't have a wife (divorced three times) or any dependents that would need other coverage...
So far he has had neurosurgery to clear up some severe back problems, and then a cornea transplant to take care of his vision problems and it has not cost him a single dollar...I have heard some horror stories about VA doctors and hospitals but my friend has not had a single bad experience with them....He is only 63 so he still has two years before he is eligible for Medicare...
I registered about a year ago but have not yet had the need to use them....If the X retirees premium continues to go off the scale I will be sorely tempted to drop it and go exclusively with the VA medical until I reach Medicare age...
My wife is 4 years younger than me so right now it behooves me to keep the X coverage as long as I can so I can maintain coverage for her but if it reaches the point that the premiums go completely out of sight I will have no other choice than to drop it...
Ltjg, USNR and retired Xeroid
Boatbum
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sorry for the delay in getting back to you kilo . i've been out of town a few days . your question regarding V A insurance is good . my brother , who is a retired COASTIE ( coast guard ) , had colon cancer and the V A covered his medical expenses until they figured out he had other medical coverage . he also had medical coverage under a second retirement plan . now the V A will not continue medical coverage paying the bills for him .
i think if you have no other coverage , it's probably o.k . the problem i've heard is that they do not have clinics every where . and you may have to travel quite a distance to get the checkups / treatments you want . i've also heard that the treatment isn't always first rate . :( . i used to have a copy machine ( a 5100 that wasn't assigned to me but i helped the primary tech more than a few times on it . machine canceled later after i retired for competitive gear if i remember correctly ) on my team in a V A hospital and remember seeing the vets getting their medical care there .
since i'm a Vietnam vet ( Navy - electrical's mate - aft five inch gun mount battle station on a old war war two destroyer durning the war for shore bombardment support ) , if i needed the coverage , i would register with them if i needed to in the event my xerox retiree medical coverage gos away . i'm lucky there is a large V A hospital just a few miles from me . :) . matter of fact , this V A hospital is right next door in the same medical center complex to UnitedHealth Care's preferred hospital in my area .
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received a letter from ADP Benefit Services in Salt Lake City , UT dated july 9th , 2004 . the letter mentions the changes coming to the Xerox medical payment system . there was also a Pre - Authorized Debit Authorization form enclosed with the letter if you wanted to have your monthly payment taken out of a bank checking or savings account . has the usual instructions of sending in a voided check or deposit slip with the filled in form to return to ADP in Utah .
letter mentions being able to prepay or pay by credit card later . :) . looking forward to seeing how this will be handled on the matter of choice web site http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) web site . letter mentioned this will be the web site for this later . retirees can AND SHOULD access this site year round , not just during open enrollment periods in the fall of every year , for updated information regarding their benefits .
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boatbum ,
i have a ex - xeroid friend whose husband recently ( this spring ) retired from the Teamsters Union and they have NO retiree health care coverage beyond the minimum COBRA coverage time limits . they will be looking at the open insurance market shortly and expect to pay up wards of $500 each a month and more for their three kids . one of which is a special needs child that will need coverage the rest of his life .
his Teamster pension check is excellent , but they'll give a lot of that back to pay for their health care and drug costs . :(
i have another ex - xeroid friend whose husband is retired military and they both use his military health care coverage and are very happy with it . the costs to them is nothing - free . :)
my wife is retired Laborer's Union and her pension check is excellent but she did not qualify for retiree medical coverage and those laborer retirees who did qualify complain about the excessive costs so i have my wife covered under my xerox retiree health care plan .
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A.R.X.E ( association of retired xerox employees ) ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) announces " Flex Plan August Billing Problems " . " that the latest billing from ADP does not reflect the payment that was made in july " . ADP says they " are working to get the ' kinks ' in the process fixed " .
for more details go to A.R.X.E. 's web site .
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Hey Al, It's official, I am Retired. After one year of salary continuance I recieved a letter from Ann Mulcahy and a gold watch. I thought that I had been completely forgotten. It looks like there are still some shades of the old "blue" X.
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well, i got a swell plaque, guess i'll have to buy my own watch
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congradulations ifs . :D . it was one of the greatest moments of my life . especially after surviving all those years of cutbacks and watching several of my friends leave sooner than they planned for one reason or another . i got a letter too and a $300 gift certificate from Penny's store that i gave the wife . and here 4 1/2 years later , she still has $12 and change still left on it . ? ?
my retired xeroid friends and i comment everytime we talk how nice to was to work for the big " X " while it was good AND how nice it is to be gone now :blink: that it's not so good . we were lucky to have our career when we did . not of us would want to start with xerox now . :unsure: .
let us know how retirement treats ya .
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if you stop by the nearest xerox office kilo869 , you might find old watches in the outgoing trash bins as the currently employed techs come out and throw them away . ? ? :blink:
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we didn't even get a 30 year tenure dinner or gift for 30 yrs
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i got to go to the twenty year tenure dinner in san francisco ( my wife's favorite award - even more than the acapulco par club trip i won years earlier ) and a twenty five year tenure dinner there too . what a beautiful city . i rode the trolly cars all day . and the " street scene " was better than television . i'd stand there and block the sidewalk watching the weird people do their routine on the sidewalk . shortly after that they stopped the long service tenure dinners . :( .
like i said , i wouldn't trade my xerox career for anything . and i also wouldn't go back to work for them now for anything . right time - right place . i do wish xerox well :) though cause of my retiree health care bennies . and because i still have friends currently employed there that can use the thoughts and prayers .
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the $450 billion dollar pension shortfall :
http://www.2000wave.com/pdf/mwo081304.pdf[/url]\
as with all the other links i give , you have to read each one with a grain of salt keeping in mind the source . just remember whose money you're dealing with when you decide to make investment decisions . :) .
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the matterofchoice ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) web site has a new pop up screen after you log in :
it states there is a customer satisfaction survey available ( Adobe Reader required ) in the FAQs tab under " 2004 Survey Results " . i read the two page survey and it looks like the matterofchoice web site will be the communication of choice in the future between xerox and retirees .
what i also found interesting was the additional links under the FAQs tab that referenced a august 2004 newsletter ( that i could not make work ? ) and a " salaried future flex retirees " link i couldn't make work either . it's almost as if they were still under construction .
the medicare link on that tab still works as it always did in the past .
stay tuned as i will return to the site later to check out the newsletter and salaried future flex retiree links for availability and report here when they are functioning .
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********* IMPORTANT POST *************
the matterofchoice web site above link for the August newsletter works ( adoble reader required ) . the first issue is 12 pages long so load up the printer . the newsletter wil be called : e X tra . this first issue has a cover letter from Lawrence M. Becker , Director , Xerox Corporate Benefits . in this letter , Lawrence suggests that those that do not have internet access at home that " you may be able to use the internet at your local library " , so this MAY be the ONLY way you can access this information . the title of this issue is " News for Xerox Old and New Plan Retirees " .
page two has detailed annual enrollment instructions with separate important messages for " Old Plan Retirees " .
page seven has a important message for medicare eligible people .
most of this is a preview of the second newsletter we'll receive in october with more detail instructions for the annual enrollment durning the november 1 through november 19 period . apparently this newsletter will be the vehicle of communication between xerox and us as retirees . and the matterofchoice web site will be used for this purpose .
the link for " salaried future flex retiree " still doesn't work yet on the FAQs tab . i will report here when it does . stay tuned . i'm sure ARXE ( association of retired xerox employees ) will weight in later on their comments too . i'll report on that at that time too .
:unsure: as a personal note , this is the first time i've seen this information that wasn't reported on by ARXE first before i saw it issued from xerox . so this may be a sign of ARXE not being brought in on this before it was issued to us . :blink: . a sign of things to come maybe .
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received a phone call this morning from a retired xeroid . he is a snow bird and sometimes his mail forwarding takes weeks and months . mine , when i'm in hawaii , can take days and weeks . in any event , he received notice from ADP Benefit Services in his weeks / months old mail that his xerox retiree medical coverage was being canceled because he was 60 days behind in his billing . this tech had paid ahead for the entire year of 2004 in january like i did ( on advice i gave him at the time ) . i told him to call ADP in Salt Lake City and resolve the situation on the phone . in my case several weeks ago i solved my similar problem with the mail . in his case , because he's running up on the " 60 day and out " policy , i told him to call ASAP .
the lesson of this story is they WILL cancel you if you fall behind . see my posts of july 1st , july 15th , and july 22nd on this forum and topic for backround details on my own personal similar situation .
i also warned my old team mate of the changes coming and that he might want to " stay in touch " alittle more often ( he hasn't been " on line " for over a year now - retirement is good ) , cause the stuff can hit the fan in the next couple of months if he misses the annual enrollment period coming up . cause instead of the default being as it was in the past , " if you make no selection , you will get what you had in the past " , the future default could be lessor coverage or NO coverage .
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i received a e - mail from KT6135 dated today . his e - mail was : " Allan , i forget , what is the RIGP and TRA ? . and why does it show the CBRA . can u explan to me what they are . Thanks KT " .
my answer was :
KT ,
sorry for the delay in getting back to you . here is your answers :
the RIGP is the " Retirement Income Guarantee Plan " . the retirement formula is based on the adverage of your five ( 5 ) highest - paid calendar years and your years of benefit service . the formula is : 1.4% of your highest - adverage pay X ( times ) years of service ( up to 30 ) = ( equals ) your annual retirement benefit . there is also a alternative method for long service employees that does not limit your years to 30 . this formula is 1.0% of your highest - adverage pay X ( times ) years of service = ( equals ) your annual retirement benefit .
normal retirement age is 65 . you are eligible for a UNREDUCED retirement plan formula at that age .
early retirement is between age 55 and 65 with at least 10 years of vesting service . early retirement reduction is 5% for EACH year that you begin receiving benefits before age 62 for retirement with 30 or more years of vesting service for those 55 or older and 5% for each year with less than 30 years of service before 65 .
this is what is known as a DEFINED BENEFIT PLAN or PENSION . these are getting rare and will go away . the trend already shows this . xerox will no longer offer these for people hired after january 1st , last year ( 2003 ) . so for those retiring in 20013 ( remember 10 years to get vested for retirement ) , this will no longer be offered .
the CBRA is the " Cash Balance Retirement Account " . this is a account to which xerox makes annual employer credits equal to 5% of your eligible pay . this account earns annual interest , which is credited daily . this annual interest rate is equal to the one - year Treasury bill . PLUS 1% . for added stability , the crediting rate also has a two precentage point floor - it can never be more than two percentage points lower than the preceding year's crediting rate .
the TRA , if you were hired before 1989 , is a account that changes daily based on the investment results of the funds in which your account was invested as of december 31 , 1989 . no further contributions or employer credits are made to this account . the TRA balance fluctuates from the investment results of the fund which your account was invested as of december 31 , 1989 . for most this is the stock market .
at the moment you will get the higher of the three ( or actually four if you have exceptionally long service ) .
it shows a CBRA cause that might be the higher of the three accounts if the stock market gos down ( thereby lowering the transitional account ) or your highest five years are not good or you retire at 55 with a reduced formula ( thereby lowering your RIGP formula benefit ) . and there for awhile when the stock market was lower , the cash balance was actually higher as the transitional account value fell with the stock market when the secular bear market began in 2000 .
the above is from the " xerox & you - wealthwise " book dated september , 1998 . i think xerox probably has a new book out since they changed their retirement plans january 1st last year ( 2003 ) for all their new employees ( no more retiree medical coverage i think :blink: ) . this would be for all new hires going forward i think . and PLEASE talk to xerox and hewitt before taking any of the above as gospel . my experience , and others i've talked to , is hewitt is EXCELLENT to talk to and you will usually ALWAYS hear the same thing from hewitt no matter who you talk to . which isn't always the case :( with other divisions ( human resources ? ? ) of xerox . as xerox states numerous times in their documentation , " this is NOT a contract between you and xerox " .
i STRONGLY suggest you develop a dialog between your self and hewitt / xerox if you have questions . THEY are the determining factor , NOT me . and lastly , this is NOT investment advice from xertech or myself . please consult your own investment advisors .
p.s. as one of my retired xeroid friends says , " in the future you will be offered YOUR 401(k) ..... or your 401(k) ......... or your 401(k) " . PERIOD . end of story . :blink: .
for any not aware of my personal policy , i will answer all e - mails sent to me not only back to your e - mail address on the e - mail , but also on one of my forums unless you request otherwise . i feel we all learn by sharing . even personal information .
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just got a e - mail from KT :
" Allan ,
i am requesting a roll over form from Xerox . i wish to roll my 401k that i have put in .
can or do i have to request also for the RIGP and since my esop share was converted to common share .
is this all over under the one form of roll over ? KT " .
my response was :
" KT ,
really suggest you DISCUSS all your options with Hewitt . also who you decide to roll over your 401(k) to ( your new custodian ) will have specific instructions as what they want you to do too .
this is TOO BIG to screw up KT . talk to the custodian who you are going to roll over your account to and be sure to ask them what to do . AND talk to xerox / hewitt . you've got lots of options . including NOTHING while you educate yourself as to what's best to do for yourself .
i've had retired xeroid friends who rolled the entire thing over . and i just rolled my transitional account over to a rollover I.R.A. and took my ESOP shares as common shares in my personal account and paid taxes on them . the rest of my 401(k) - the before tax - after tax - company savings - and company match i left with xerox .
good luck . let us know what you learn and what you decide to do .
allancoleman " .
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while i was absent a few days from the board , the association of retired xerox employees ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) put out a memo dated 8 - 25 - 04 from the chairman : Dave Coriale
the memo is involved but one sentence states : " i believe that the impact of the announced changes could easily add an increase in excess of $1,000 to the out of pocket costs for each of the pre - 65 Flex Plan retirees " .
suggest those that are members log in and those that aren't members yet to think about adding your voice to ours .
get out your check book kilo869 . :(
p . s . the link for the " Salaried Future Flex Retiree " under the FAQ tab on matterofchoice we site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) still doesn't work yet . stay tuned .
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the xerox / hewitt 401(k) web site ( http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url] ) announces " EARLY LOAN PAYOFF REQUESTS PROCESS IS CHANGING " .
if you have a request to make AFTER 9/24/04 and still have a account with xerox please visit the site to get further details .
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Well, Greenspan is nothing if not truthful. I think you and I have both agreed that there's not much point in counting on social security. A thousand dollars would be a big hit, then I would have to decide if I want to take insurance from my present employer, then hope to get back in when I really retire.
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you're right kilo that we hadn't figured on social security . at least i haven't . BUT , having said that , i feel that those in our age group will collect the social security we were told in our annual printout we receive every year . it may come with more restrictions than in the past , but the chances are good it'll be there . i certainly wouldn't want to be any younger and depend on it though .
as for opting OUT of xerox retiree medical coverage now and THEN depending on the ability to get back in LATER , i wouldn't do that if it were me . but everyone has to decide that for themselves . i'm just speaking for myself . the extra thousand dollars might still put me less than most of my retired friends pay for medical coverage . i'll just wait until open enrollment to see where the numbers come in .
let us know what you decide to do .
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Kilo,
I received my $400 gift certificate and an order form for a watch,clock,crystal bowl, or something similar last week....
Lets see, $400 divided by 40 years.....Hmmmmm, that comes out to $10 per year....Damn, what a great company I worked for....
Retiree flex premium is $400 per month right now because I still have a college student on my insurance but that will end with the new Matter of Choice signup....Of course the premium will still be sky high, but at least we do have insurance, maybe for not much longer if the company decides to drop us completely...That has happened to more than one of my retired friends and they were really up the creek without a paddle after that...
How did the inlaws place make out during Charlie??? My mother-in-law in Ocala had hardly any wind at all...Lots of rain but no wind....My cousin in Naples had tons of rain but no wind damage either...Naples received over 17 inches of rain before, during and after Charlie passed by...
Still hoping to make the move during the first quarter...We will be going to Ocala before the end of the year to buy a house and make ready for the move...
Boatbum
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hi boatbum ,
definitely agree with your observation that once you're without medical coverage at a later age , you are really up the creek without a paddle . i'm going to stick it out with xerox's retiree medical coverage until they dump me . THEN i'll look for a new " paddle " :) .
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Allan,
I was rereading your posts and the news on the airlines and their wanting out of the pension business..
I checked with an old high school buddy who is a fairly recently retired United Airlines pilot...He was mandatorily retired at age 60 per FAA regs....He opted for as much as he could in a lump sum but couldn't take it all that way...He still gets a United pension check every month and says that the pilots pension plan was overfunded in the '90's and is funded through the end of '05...
It is the poor mechanics and flight attendants plans that are underfunded and are in dire straits at this time...It really seems unfair that the folks who were making $200K per year are secure with their pension plan but the poor blue collar working stiffs are the ones who are almost broke...Sounds almost like a company that I used to work for...The folks at the top have their golden parachutes and the higher paid execs have enough to make their own investment plan but the folks at the bottom liken it to the parable that "s##t always flows downhill"...
Boatbum
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sometimes life isn't fair boatbum . :( . by the way , hope your move to the sunshine state gos well . sure like florida's income tax status . :) . good luck on your move .
p.s. i added this line on the following day ( the 28th ) after thinking about it overnite : and thanks for bringing into this conversation boatbum , your personal observations from your retired airline friend . it really helps in understanding this national pension issue for all of us .
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speaking about Florida , interesting article :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...ng/23373/998478[/url]
sad :( , but interesting .
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A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox retirees ) offers the " Old Plan / New Plan Newsletter " dated august , 2004 on their web site ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) that i've already reported on this forum on august 15th . adobe reader required on both sites and this is also available on the matterofchoice web site ( http://matterofchoice.com[/url] ) for those without a A.R.X.E membership to be able to log into their site . course , you'll have to " belong " ( have a account in either site ) in order to log onto either site in any event . :) . those guys at A.R.X.E. must be working weekends for us as this wasn't available on their site yesterday . ? ? .
by the way , the " Salaried Future Flex Retiree " link on the FAQ tab on the matterofchoice web site still does not work yet . i'll report here when it does . stay tuned .
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well the folks place suvived ok, bu the neighbor across the street lost their roof, it was newer and better maintaned (year round folks) can't figure hurricanes.
i'm planning on staying with the med. plan unless there is a huge increase.
i only put in thirty years, i guess that's why i got nothing.
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glad to hear your folks came through fine kilo . you're right , there's no figuring a hurricane . one house gets blown away and the one next door just has their insect screens cleaned out by the wind . ? ?
i'm sticking with xerox's medical plan kilo til they dump us . it's like i always thought when different managers wanted me to resign :( or quit when ever i had a disagreement with them . i always told them , " fire me " . usually i never heard anything more from them . and i ended up out lasting some of those same managers . several of which were actually terminated by xerox for the same stuff they were trying to pull on me .
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Allan,
Amen, to the sticking with the health plan and outlasting the managers....I outlasted and outlived a whole bunch of managers who should have been terminated many years before they got what was coming to them...
My philosophy was always that the external customer was the guy who was making my paycheck possible and that if I took care of them then they would make it possible for those paychecks to keep on coming every payday...
I could write reams and reams of stories about Xerox managers who were way past their level of incompetence...Thinking back over the years, I'm glad the majority of managers didn't fall in to that category or we would have been out of business a long time ago...
Our retiree health insurance is definitely not inexpensive but it is better than the alternative...
Boatbum
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told you i would report when the " Salaried Future Flex Retiree " link worked on the FAQ's tab on the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) . it works now .
and they have really changed the log in screen and broken it into two different segments :
one mentions " Security ( for current retirement or union benefit enrollment ) " .
and the second mentions " Future Retirees ( salaried employees click here ) and ( union employees click here ) " .
the first part is the normal log in screen and password we've always used . the second new part are just links that do not require a log in password .
check it out . stay tuned .
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couldn't have said it better myself boatbum . appreciate your input here . helps others i think when they are confronted with issues they feel aren't quite right in their own minds .
i always put the customer first too and always slept well at nite . tossed and turned a few nites thinking about fixing machine problems or managers but never worried for long when i put the customer first .
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i too always put customer first, and when i explained it to my manager they usually understood, plus the fact that i had a decent reputation they knew i was doing it for the right reasons
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in the end most of my managers understood too kilo . but there was the occassional butt head . :) usually my biggest difficulties were with sales managers or as a result of sales managers going to my service manager with issues .
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we just recently passed the 5,000 hit mark in this forum . this is a adverage of 17.85 hits a day since we began this forum in november of last year . this compares with our adverage of 13.88 hits adverage at the first " grand " mark and 18.51 hits adverage at the second " grand " mark . we would have probably adveraged more daily hits if owen wellbrock didn't add a topic to this forum . ( don't worry ow , clayton's worth it :) ) .
my thanks to all the people who helped to make this possible . especially kilo869 , boatbum , and ifs ( congradulations on your retirement ) , and others ( all your e - mails KT6135 :) ) for their input in making this forum successful .
once again , let me know if you have any ideas or suggestions on how to make this forum better or feel free to start a forum / topic of your own . we'll look at this again at the 10,000 hit mark .
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we had a great geo rep, always talking to the techs, springing for happy hour at the local watering hole, christmas party at his house, treated the hi-volume operators well---then that nitwit from ibm went to vertical markets.....the rest is history
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we had a great geo rep, always talking to the techs, springing for happy hour at the local watering hole, christmas party at his house, treated the hi-volume operators well---then that nitwit from ibm went to vertical markets.....the rest is history
Forgot to log on, but i'll bet you knew it was me
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thanks for the comment kilo . and actually i usually always sprung for the happy hour , breakfast , pizza , lunch , etc . it was because i was a geo rep and most of my career didn't have the opportunity to talk and visit with other reps . you really learn alot of information sharing problems with other reps . i always came away from those rare get - to - gethers with a follow up service courtesy call the following day to one of my problem machines with a fresh new fix i had gotten over a bull session with other reps .
thanks for reminding me of the swell people i enjoyed working with over the years . :)
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you've got my respect, i always worked in eastern massachussets, and always dedicated to one product line, luckily i was on hi-volume when they went to the latest pay structure
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unfortunitely my experience as a geo multi - product rep was i knew NOTHING :) about EVERYTHING . it WAS nice spending time in xerox schools . especially Leesburg . i enjoyed Santa Anna on the west ( left ? ) coast too in the beginning before Leesburg opened . went to many schools back to back in order to save on plane fares . i remember in the beginning when xerox used to fly us first class . boy , that didn't last long . :)
it was easier the last couple of years when i was specialized on 1075's ( nobody else could or wanted to fix 'em :) ) and later 5100's ( no one wanted to work on them either , especially ALL the retrofits that came out in the beginning on them :) ) , and finally 1065's . 5065's , and 5365's ( which i enjoyed working on cause you could walk in the door with the exact part in your hand based on the problem code given to work support ) when no one else was left to work on them and it wasn't worth sending anyone to school on'em cause they weren't selling 'em anymore . but it was not as exciting as every call being on a different machine . half my company vehicle was books and manuels ( this was way before laptops and even after i got a laptop , many products i was trained on didn't have software for them to use the computer ) . i used to HAVE to dedicate a certain part of my work day / week ( usually evenings on my own time so as to not take away from prime customer time ) to doing manuel updates or else i was swamped in short order . i remember all the different manuel covers they made for the different products . some were plastic bound and some were steel ring binders and all were different sizes . and i usually didn't have parts cause my product list was too long to carry much of anything beyond photoreceptors ( drums :) ) and feed wheels .
i was lucky in that when i was employed i was maxed out and so was everyone i worked with . after about my fifth year in my career i stayed maxed out and it was nice . now with the different pay scales i notice a difference in the morale when i stop at the local office .
brings back memories . mostly ALL good . right place - right time . wouldn't have done anything differently .
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the association of retired xerox employees ( A.R.X.E ) has released the august issue of " xerox & you " on their web site ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) .
this letter is actually linked under the heading of the " MAY " issue on the right tab and under the current newsletter link on the site , so it's confusing . this issue is coming to us late and mainly covers preventive health care . although there is a excellent section on POST - 65 instructions for medicare qualified retirees in this newsletter for those who still have that decision in front of them . the process to ensure this is done right is still confusing to me and others . luckly , i don't have to do this for five more years yet . my suggestion is to discuss this with others who have just went through it and even then to discuss it with xerox / hewitt while you're still in that enrollment period .
i DO NOT delete past references to these newsletters although they are archived on A.R.X.E. 's web site because many readers to this forum either haven't joined yet :( and have a password to be able to log on . or worked for the big X and are interested , but did not retire for one reason or other and can't qualify to join A.R.X.E. . and i usually give a brief review of the contents of the present newsletter for those folks . enjoy .
p.s. A.R.X.E. got around to correcting their error mentioned above the following day ( 7th ) and now the august newsletter is actually under the august heading instead of may .
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I came on board in '72 and I sure remember those good times, even with competion from big blue and kodak. when dave kerns said we were moving away from light lens i thought it was science fiction and i ended up on 6180's.
i do remember when xerox opened 401(k) to the troops, i signed right away, couldn't afford the max but all my raises went in, anyone who has a company match should at least contribute that much.
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i started in 72 myself kilo . it was fun . i actually took a cut in pay from my former job to hire on with xerox . i was impressed with the benefits & training . and i got plenty of both . and after awhile ( a union scare or two ) , the pay was excellent .
i signed up for the 401(k) right off the bat too . and if i wasn't maxed out in my 401(k) deductons the first year , i definitely was the second year and stayed that way through my whole career . i also put my entire profit sharing back into the 401(k) too . in those days , as you remember , it wasn't unusual to get another 15% a year extra . i can remember putting 15% before taxes in and 15% after taxes in and profit sharing . this was before the federal goverment put in caps later . i " PAID myself first " as i called it . in the end close to retirement age , all my team mates wanted to know how and why i had so much in my 401(k) . and i told them that i paid myself first .
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hi allen, i was thinking about the occasional bashing on the old cse web site and wonder if it was from those who were'nt around for the good times. maybe us old f*rts just figured that the good times would come around again.
my wife always admonished our boys to pay themselves first, and when they started work i gave them what advice i could about 401(k), i'm sure they'll need it more than we do.
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your comment about the company bashing that went on at the ole cse web site brings back memories . i spent quite a bit of time defending xerox over there . i'm sure there's alot of reasons some have difficulty with some / or most of xerox's corporate decisions . i have trouble with alot of it too . but it's like a few of my team mates always said at the end of alot of bitch'in sessions , " xerox's pay check was always good every week " and " if you don't like it , don't let the door hit you on the way out " .
my personal experiences were , for the most part , positive . and i was very fortunite to have worked for one of the best companies there ever was . not so sure i can still say that now , but for me it was wonderful .
and you're right , some of us old guys look around the cornor to see if things won't get better . but , some how , i doult it now with the current market enviroment for copiers . used to be a really important place in almost every company . i can remember customers letting me park in their preferred parking slots . now , it's like taking out the trash with some customers .
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ah yes Al, it was good to be The King.
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you know jfs , it was nice when it was just us in the copier business and really not much else . i remember when customers couldn't buy xerox machines at any price . they weren't for sale .
our process was the only ' dry ' process . the others tried to use a ' wet ' process that was a joke for copy quality .
it was nice being a part of a company that had the only process that was worth a darn to makes copies . everyone that asked me who i worked for was impressed when i said i was employed by xerox . i still feel that same respect from some people who asked from whom i retired .
unfortunitely alot of water has passed under the bridge . alot of stock holders have lost their money on xerox stock . not the least of which was many of my team mates and fellow xerox employees around the world who switched their 401(k)'s into xerox stock as it fell below $60 a share . there were buyers all the way down . alot of people lost alot of money on xerox .
it has also been difficult watching xerox continue false sales practices to stay on top . and for years i've said that xerox sends sales people to school to teach them how to lie . and then a sales manager reminded me that every time a xerox sales rep sold a machine , 17 people got paid . including ME :) .
companies are not very good at re - inventing them selves . they aren't very good at changing their business models . especially when it seems the most successful business models are based on low pay , no benefits , and poor training . and of course all that leads to high turn over and getting further in the hole .
i was at the right place at the right time . and i wish xerox every success in getting back on top . if for no other reason than because i'm xerox ' blue ' through and through ( i think it's xerox ' red ' now :) ) , than because i hope xerox can continue to pay my retiree benefits and benefits for other retirees .
" proud to be xerox service "
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i wish you could hear me singing the amen chorus....what saddens me is i know a couple of top notch tech reps who are just waiting to turn 55
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Kilo,
Florida is looking worser and worser all the time.....How did your inlaws place make out during Frances???
My mother-in-law and both her sons had very little damage in the Ocala-Gainesville area....A few tree limbs down but they lost power for several days....If Ivan continues on the path of destruction he is on now there won't be much left down there and I should be able to pick up a house at a decent price because of the mass exodus out of there....I-75 will be bumper to bumper with northbound U-Hauls...
Boatbum
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they haven't heard yet, but we think that all is ok. they're in englewood, just south of venice, oddly my wife's aunt and uncle left their place in venice to spend the summer in a campground in nh, which got hit with a mini-tornado.
it does make you wonder if it's safe to move to the sunshine state.
hey allen, any tsunamis in the aloha state?
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Kilo,
In early January of '99 I went to Guam to help out after they had been hit by Supertyphoon Paka in late December....The devastation was unbelievable...The winds had topped out at over 235 mph and I saw little slivers of wood that had been driven into trees and buildings like a needle...There are no really large trees on the island, everything grows dense and very close to the ground....I can see why now because they get hit with typhoons on a real regular basis...All of the utility poles are made from concrete and it was snapping those babies off like twigs...
The people who live there are so resilient and they just bounce back from these things and get on with their lives....Most of the newer houses are also made from concrete and most have built in typhoon shutters...
I was expecting to be really roughing it when I got there but I was in for a real shock...The three of us who went were put up in an ocean front three bedroom condo with satellite TV, hot and cold running water, cold AC and the best of everything...They are so used to brownouts and blackouts that all the resorts and hotels have their own back up diesel generators...Most of the CSE's who lived there had been without power or running water for over two weeks....We had bunches of them bringing their laundry to our condo because we had a washer and dryer that worked...I'll never forget the '99 Super Bowl game either..Because of the time and date line difference it came on over there at 9:30AM on Monday and a holiday was declared....We had the whole crew in our condo with beer, booze, sushi, shashemi, tuna jerky and every kind of munchie you could imagine...Keep in mind this was happening early on a Monday morning....Needless to say, no machines were fixed that day...
I will never forget the people and the hospitality that they extended to us while we were there....Their attitude and mindset was so positive about the whole thing...It takes a special kind of individual to put up with those storms year after year...I'm sure there are people like that in Florida but there are also those that will be bailing out while they can...I told my wife we can pick up a house real cheap, all we have to do is find all of it and put it back together...
Boatbum
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you're right kilo869 , ALL the techs i talk to are on a countdown to 55 and OUT . morale is pretty bad at my local office .
good luck to you & boatbum on your florida relatives . my sister lives in wrightsville beach , in north ( by god ) carolina and they survive all hurricanes very well . they have made custom heavy wooden shutters that they bolt on all their windows and doors for every storm and are built on concrete pilings . you can build so your house isn't such a concern . they are set up to do without power and water for days & weeks at a time . just a part of life to them .
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Allan,
The BIG HOT BUTTON with X now seems to be call escalations that the FMCS has to get involved in....
GEEZ, maybe if X hadn't raped the service force there might be enough people out there to take care of the external customer....I spoke with a "real genuine X CSE" yesterday that I worked shoulder to shoulder with for several years and he said as long no calls were forwarded to the FMCS and the monthly parts plan wasn't too far out of bed that it was "business as usual"...The CSE's that I maintain contact with are running from daylight till dark just trying to keep their heads above water...Most of them are counting the days till something better or age 55 comes along....It just gets worser and worser for the "in the trenches folks" but the execs have the golden parachutes and keep pulling the ripcords on a regular basis...
I was really proud to tell folks for years that I worked for Xerox, and then I had to explain to them what Xerox was and what we did....When I started on 1-6-64 the 813(our 200 pound "desktop copier") had just been introduced and the 914 was the "bread and butter" of the company....I went to training on those machines, back to back, in the back of a warehouse in Atlanta, freezing my buns off because the warehouse only got heat if the doors to the front office were left open...
Times they are a'changing, to paraphrase an old Bob Dillon tune but I'm proud to have been a part of something that changed and revolutionized the office environment. I'm glad I'm out of it because it ain't ever gonna' be like that again....
Just spoke with my realtor in Ocala and he says, "Come on down there are bargains to be had"....He also said they are praying that Ivan gives them a wide berth because they can't take any more right now..His power was just restored today and Ivan is on the way and they have much more cleanup to do after Frances..
Boatbum
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agree with your comments on xerox boatbum . i was trained on the 914 ( the instructor cutting the ' programmer belt ' - the furthest inboard - was our first class project ) first . the instructor gleefully went around with his side cutters and cut all the belts on all the machines . took us days to figure out how to get all the other drives & belts out of the way while we lay on the floor on the left side of that machine under the paten glass to replace all that stuff . and then the 660 , duplicators ( 2400 - 3600 - 7000 ) schools were after that . then , of course , the 720 and 1000's were the upgrade to the 914's .
and more importantly i agree with your realtor on property values being a " buyers " market right now . matter of fact , if Ivan came through ( no fault of yours :) ) , the properties could be had for less . also will give you a good idea what STANDS up in florida and what doesn't .
my condo in kailua - kona , hawaii is two foot thick solid concrete pours and the local government has declared that our condo project is a civil defence shelter in our underground - underbuilding parking area and all of our common areas like lobbies and hall ways . so most can and probably will shelter from a hurricane in our condo complex . including me if i'm there durning a hurricane .
this " after " hurricane trip to florida can be a real education for you to obtain a real solid structure for you and your family for years to come . if it were me , i would go down as soon as possible and observe and find the best structure you can while they are still recovering and you can see what's behind all the fancy trim . plus , you may find a really " motivated " seller who wants to move further inland .
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Allan,
10-4 on the idea to shop for quality structures...
After hurricane Andrew just about wiped out Homestead and a whole bunch of the rest of south Florida in 1992 the building codes eventually got revised and a whole bunch of building inspectors lost their jobs and many builders and contractors were raked over the coals about the shoddy workmanship and "drive by" inspections that many builders had been getting by with...
The late 90's buildings are now built with "CBS"...This is reinforced cement and concrete block covered with stucco...Looks like a typical Southern Californian house but built like a tank....Having many relatives in Florida is a big advantage because they can direct me to the people who build the best structures...I lived on the beach in Pensacola in a typical FL beach house that was built in the early 60's, concrete block, jalousie windows, terazzo floors and a flat roof covered with gravel....It was amazing how much punishment those $10K houses would take...After that the builders got greedy and built something that looked great but wouldn't stand up to much more than a Force 8 gale....
We are flying back in late October or early November to do some serious shopping in preparation for our move....
Boatbum
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sounds like you're on the right track boatbum . let us know how it gos and what you find . good luck .
p.s. nice to not be wearing pagers , cell phones ringing off the hook with voice mail and call waiting , and shagging service calls right now isn't it ? ? :)
ah , retirement . love it . :rolleyes:
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A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) is stepping up the stakes of the game for our health care benefits by offering a poll on their web site : ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) . the poll reads :
a) . do nothing . i am satisfied with the status quo and am prepared to accept increasing costs .
b ) . exercise our right as shareholders to offer proposals to the shareholders of the company .
i voted and the results of the poll to date is :
92 votes thus far with 100% voting in favor of A.R.X.E. 's action . obviously you can tell by the results so far how i voted .
stayed tuned for future statements .
p.s. if there was every a time to join and vote and take a active part in preserving your retiree benefits , now is that time . you can join on line . help kilo & i pull the wagon instead of riding for free and adding weight for the rest of us retirees to fight your battles . :blink: .
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hi allen, 118 votes, still 100%
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thanks for the update AND the vote kilo869 . sometimes you have to take a stand .
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we're up to 343 ballots cast kilo and we're still holding at 100% . i'll do another count tomorrow .
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well kilo , i knew it had to happen : out of 392 votes cast so far , there is 391 for action with a percentage of 99.74% and ONE vote against action for .26% . :blink:
must be a sales rep <_< , what'd ya think ? ?
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485 ballots for = 99.79% and one ballot again for 0.21% . looks like the membership is getting pretty active on the vote . there's 1,900 A.R.X.E. members now . hopefully A.R.X.E. can take these ballots to xerox and mention a presence at a future public shareholders meeting to get alittle cooperation in futher discussions about health care costs .
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ballots are slowing down now . must be cause football season starts today :) . latest count is 550 votes for action and now 2 votes for no action . A.R.X.E. wants to have at least half their membership ( 950 members ) to vote and pass this action before they go to xerox with the results of this poll .
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the ballot count at A.R.X.E. now is 637 for and now 3 votes against action . i'll change the number count durning the day on this post instead of posting a new message . the voters participation has definitely slowed down .
p.s. why don't you take a break for awhile kilo869 . i'll pull the wagon until others join A.R.X.E. ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) and add their voice to ours . :) .
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hi allen,
i just posted a quick note on the xerox alumni site encouraging membership
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appreciate it kilo869 . we need all the members we can get right now . maybe you could post or give us a link to your xerox alumni web site . ? ?
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vote count at A.R.X.E. has reached 671 for action and still 3 against action on our health care costs . looks like one of the three voters against action yesterday changed their vote last nite and then another voter went negative this morning again . ? ?
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You don't have to be a retiree, just a former employee, one time joining fee of $10, it is not so much a "PAC" as a networking group.
http://www.xeroxalumni.org[/url]
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sorry for the delay in getting back to you kilo869 . i was out of town and away from the wide world of wait for a few days . thanks for the ' alumni ' link .
the latest vote talley from A.R.X.E. is 753 votes for action & 3 against .
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the A.R.X.E. vote count has really slowed down . 771 for action and the three people that voted against action haven't been taken out yet <_<
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just received a e - mail from A.R.X.E. regarding their poll . the e - mail stated they had received 817 ballots ( it's actually 848 as of this post ) and needed at least half of their membership ( approximately 900 members ) to pass this measure before they can move forward . A.R.X.E. says they will inform the membership of their next steps as soon as they ' solidify ' their next moves after the vote period closes on the 24th of this month . A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) encourages members who have not voted yet to do so at : ( http://www.arxe.org )
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A.R.X.E.'s appeal for more ballots brought in more votes so now the count is at 1,064 for action and 7 against . so this brings the vote over the magical half way count ( 950 ) on the present membership level ( 1,900 ) which A.R.X.E. was looking for . we should receive word sometime after the 24th when the poll is supposed to close on their plan of action with xerox to keep down the cost of our health care .
i'll update this count on this post durning the day instead of starting a new post today . so stay tuned .
p . s . these ballots are starting to really pour in now . it's over a thousand :) today . A.R.X.E. must be pleased with the support . hopefully they can come up with a good plan for our health care coverage costs before the open enrollment period . look forward to their action plan being posted on their web site ( http://www.arxe.org ) .
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latest tabulation on the A.R.X.E. poll is 1,135 votes for and now 9 against action with xerox on our retiree health care costs for 2005 . i'll update these numbers during the day here on this post . hopefully we'll get some word from the association of retired xerox employees on their action plan in the next few days / weeks .
voting has really slowed down so we'll come back to this as and if this story changes .
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the airlines are cutting everywhere, but you can fly to florida for $49. did i sleep through economics 101?
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Kilo,
Florida is probably subsidizing the airlines now just to get people to come down there...You can fly to Florida for $49 but it costs $600 for a ticket out of there... ;) I imagine I-75 North is pretty busy with moving vans and U-Hauls...
Those poor folks can't win for losing...Looks like Jeanne is drawing a bead on the FL coast for this weekend...So far our relatives in the Gainesville/Ocala area have had nothing worse than some tree limbs down and lots of debris but the condo where I used to live on Pensacola Beach was totally destroyed by Ivan...I have numerous friends along the Redneck Riviera from Gulf Shores, AL to Panama City, FL and they all suffered major damage or total loss...This has been the worst season for FL in many years...The last big one to swing through Pensacola was in '79 and they have been pretty well out of it till this year...
When Camille hit the MS coast in '69 I rented a plane and overflew the area a couple of days later and it looked like a war zone...There was a tug boat on the court house lawn in Biloxi and the court house is almost a half mile from the waterfront...
Hope your inlaws place is still in one piece...I know everyone down there is looking forward to late November or early December when the season is over..
Boatbum
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boatbum & kilo869 ,
it's the new economics101 where you give the product away . don't pay your people anything and they retire on nothing .
H.P. printers are given away . you buy a cartridge once a year or so like i do and throw it away when you have trouble with it . the new one is about the same price ( cheap ) and does more . i wouldn't want to be the H.P. rep . how can they pay him anything . ? ?
xerox and the airlines are headed down the same road as the buses and trains . wouldn't want to start over again that's for sure .
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received my hard copy today via snail mail of the ' xerox and you ' august issue already reported here on september 5th . it's available on A.R.X.E. 's web site ( http://www.arxe.org ) for those who are not on the mailing list .
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A.R.X.E ( association of retired xerox employees ) just announced ( i swear there's some people working there for us 24/7 ) the end of their poll . they thanked the 1,162 people for voting and the 1,153 for supporting their proposals :
while " there have been a few who have expressed concerns about the response of the shareholders to anything we offer " ...................
" Our proposals will operate on the principle that the shareholders would also want to reduce excessive excutive benefits . By making these proposals we will be " informing " the Xerox Board of our displeasure with the way in which senior management has continued to reduce the benefits for the retirees while maintaining egregious benefits for themselves " .
" It is our belief that all of us should be sharing the pain while the company is in trouble and conversely sharing the benefit when the business is good " .
" We will be posting the draft proposals in the next week and polling the membership to select the one which we will offer as shareholders of the company " .
stay tuned .
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do you remember when profits were up they were'nt attatched to raises, but when profits were down........
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well said Mr. Kilo869 . i'm watching A.R.X.E.'s web site several times a day now . and our next ' xerox & you ' and the new ' e X tra ' ( see my post of august 15th on this forum on this new newsletter ) only available at this time on the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com ) , should have our instructions for our upcoming open enrollment period .
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pensions :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/86836/1012846[/url]
it's not just airline pensions on the line here . :( .
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new pop up screen on the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) says :
Q . When is the 2005 Annual Enrollment period ?
A. The annual enrollment period for 2005 begins at 8:00 a.m. CT on monday , november 1st and ends at 5:00 p.m. CT on friday , november 19th .
hopefully we'll get some instructions and options and choices BEFORE this enrollment period .
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speech made by the assistant secretary ( Employee Benefit Security Administration ) of Department of Labor at the 57th National Conference of the Profit Sharing / 401(k) Council :
http://www.dol.gov/ebsa/newsroom/sp093004.html[/url]
this speech is rather long but addresses many of the issues and problems and solutions on pensions .
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A.R.X.E. sent me a personal e - mail asking me if i want to volunteer for testing of a new " Interactive Voice System " ( menu ) for the Xerox Benefits Center . it's supposed to be more ' user friendly ' . most vendors now use such a voice recognition software to answer their phones . looks like xerox is going to join the group .
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the A.R.X.E. ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) Advisory Committee met with the xerox benefits people on monday the 11th and has put out a memo on discussions with xerox on our 2005 health care plans .
a.r.x.e. was restricted by their confidentiality agreement with xerox but did say :
" The change to coinsurance for the Flex Plan retirees will affect almost all of the offerings for 2005 , both the pre - 65 and post - 65 retirees "
Old Plan and New Plan may see no further changes for 2005 affecting their plans .
there will be " ANNUAL DEDUCTIBLES " that must be satisfied in most cases before any benefit is received and there will be " MAXIMUM LIMITS TO MOST OUT - OF - POCKET EXPENSES " .
those of you who are members should log in and read the entire letter . for myself , since i already have the highest deductable ( my individual is $2000 and family is $5000 and maximum out - of - pocket is $7000 individual and $14000 family ) plan ( and the cheapest :) ) , i probably would not see alot of changes in the plan details for myself as i already have to pay quite a bit out of pocket before the plan kicks in anything . of course , i will feel any increase , as all of us will , for this same coverage .
open enrollment packets with instructions will be mailed out the week of october 25th and enrollment starts november 1st .
A.R.X.E. said they will continue to move forward in the " share holder advocacy arena " .
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A.R.X.E. announces that the xerox benefit center will hold Health Fairs in selected xerox offices around the country . they are :
Lewisville , Texas
Stamford , Connecticut
Webster , New York
Wilsonville , Oregon
El Segundo , California
this will give retirees a opportunity to meet with the various representatives of the various origanizations that deliver xerox health care to answer questions regarding your new health care changes and choices .
see A.R.X.E.'s web site ( http://www.arxe.org ) for dates and times .
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more on the airlines business models :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/.../108048/1016875[/url]
in case you were thinking the goverment or ' somebody else ' needs to do something about the airlines . there is money to be made and jobs that will be created in the airline industry . but just like the copier industry , us old ' spoiled ' birds probably aren't going to like the pay , benefits , and work conditions , and changes associated with it .
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A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) announces a poll coming out on or about october 25th on two possible PROXY PROPOSALS to present to the xerox directors board . proxy proposal choices will be posted next week . stay tuned .
no further details on the A.R.X.E. site so this is just a heads up .
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received in my snail mail this morning was a single page notification from Xerox that my " Benefits Enrollment 2005 is coming " . mention was made that instructions would be in the packets and further information would be available in the October issue of " You & Xerox " or on the matterofchoice web site .
have not seen further information from either source yet . stay tuned .
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S.E.C. looking into some pensions :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/86836/1018234
this post is from a investment site and written with the idea in mind of the affect this will have on a company individual stock price . most , if not all , share holders view pay , benefits ( retiree or otherwise ) , etc as a drag on profits .
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social security increase for next year :
http://www.ssa.gov/pressoffice/pr/2005cola-pr.htm
for those lucky enough to already be on it . :) .
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A.R.X.E. ( http://www.arxe.org ) has posted the October Flex Plan newsletter with our explanations and instructions for our open enrollment for 2005 on their web site . one of the new features to allow retirees to save further expenses now will be to allow us to accelerate our retiree flex benefit allowance from post - 65 to pre - 65 periods . this is the LifeCycle Assistance allowance ( $10,000 ) for those that are eligible that gos towards paying for our retiree health care . this was a program that many didn't understand and some said we'd never see . now it can be used to help lower your costs pre - 65 by using money that would have been spent on your health care post - 65 when medicare is going to pick up alot of the cost anyway . IF you decide to elect to accelerate your benefit , you CAN NOT switch back in the future AND you WAIVE your eligibility for a benefits allowance AND ANY XEROX medical coverage after you become eligible for MEDICARE ( this is damn important stuff here guys and gals ! :unsure: ! ) . PLEASE log on to read the full newsletter or wait for your hard copy to show up in your snail mail or call xerox benefits for further information .
caps for the amount xerox pays is posted too . i'll add to this post as i read this newsletter and learn more details .
there is also a web site for us to pay medical premiums online , but i hesitate to link the web site yet cause i haven't been able to figure out how to log - in without the instructions in our enrollment packages . when i figure it out , i'll post the link and instructions .
stay tuned .
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A.R.X.E. has also added a " Opt - in member list and search " feature so you can find other people in A.R.X.E. 's data base . i gave A.R.X.E. permission to give out my name , snail mail address , and e - mail address . for A.R.X.E. members , you can log on and find your old team mates . :) .
also allows a word search function on their site .
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A.R.X.E. has also released their poll ( it's difficult to find as are the proposals but it's there :blink: ) on the proposals to present to the xerox board of directors . they are :
1) Severance Proposal
" Shareholder proposal relating to Senior Executive Severance Agreements "
2) Options Proposal
" Stockholder proposal relating to expensing stock options "
because of the following restriction , " This is confidential information and for the use of the Association of Retired Xerox Employees and may not be reproduced or used for any other purpose " , i am unable to explan more fully the content of the proposals . they are extensive , complicated , and BOTH good . they ask us to vote for ONE due to S.E.C. rules that are explained on the site . i'd like to be able to vote for both . members please log - on and read'em and vote . they will hold the poll open for 10 days . i voted for the severance pay agreement proposal cause i think it'll get more attention from senior management . i was the third ballot and the count is one ( or 33.33% ) for the options proposal and two ( 66.67% ) for the severance proposal . so i think i'll be in the winning cornor . for now anyway . <_< . so line up gentlemen / ladies and vote . no hanging chads here . :) . and unlike florida , your vote will be counted .
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A.R.X.E. has posted the summary of the october meeting between the Xerox / ARXE Advisory Committee . it's listed under october 21st heading . in the summary it's stated :
" as a note , current active employees will be converted to a similar plan design in 2005 though the deductables are dependant on salary level . Employee Xerox medical premium contributions will be generally lower than for retirees . "
" No xerox initiated changes will be made to the Old and New Plans for retirees in 2005 . "
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the new xerox medical premium payment web site mentioned on page 9 of the october newsletter is good to go :
http://www.benedirect.adp.com
go to the Participant Login screen on the right :
under " First Time Participant User ? "
" click to register "
screen says :
First Name
Last Name
Postal Code ( does have to be exact as i learned :) )
SSN
after you are confirmed , you'll see your account and can create your own " user name " and password .
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A.R.X.E. poll on proposals to the xerox board reads :
Severance proposal = 180 responses or 51.43%
Options proposal = 152 responses or 43.43%
No choice = 18 responses or 5.14%
" i'm still on the leading side " :) . kilo . how did you vote ? ?
reads like the presidential election doesn't it ? :) ? bush - kerry - and nader .
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after further review , and several e - mail conversations with kilo869 while xertech was down ? ? , i've decided for sure NOT to accelerate my retiree flex benefit by using my " LifeCycle Assistance " allowance of $10k that was to be annunitized over my life time . this is the money you now have the option of " fast forwarding " to your pre - 65 years . but the cost is : " you waive your eligibility for a Benefits Allowance AND ANY Xerox medical coverage after you become eligible for Medicare . " plus there is NO going back once you take this option .
i usually choose the highest deductible , and least expensive :) , plan . my only hesitation is i would like to stay with UnitedHealthcare because they will be who i will be with post - 65 with xerox and i'm with them now and like them . so i'll just have to wait until the plan numbers come out to see if Aetna ? ? may be my only choice for the " High Deductible option " . ? ?
p.s. i had several e - mail exchanges with KT6135 & kilo869 while xertech was down on these topics and why xertech was down .
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the A.R.X.E. poll continues :
options proposal has 163 responses at 43.47%
severance proposal has 192 responses at 51.20%
no choice has 20 responses at 5.33%
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in case you guys haven't noticed , the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com ) has been un accessable since yesterday . probably cause they're loading our open enrollment data . stay tuned .
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as of this minute , the poll on A.R.X.E. is :
servance is 209 responses at 51.99%
option is 172 responses at 42.79%
no choice is at 21 responses at 5.22%
i'll update this post durning the day today while the ballots come in . this poll should shut down in the next few days so they ( arxe ) can present their ( winning ) proposal to the xerox board of directors .
my vote is still on the winning proposal . :) . how did you vote kilo869 . ? ?
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hey allen,
at the risk of sounding like your east coast clone i voted as you did and for the same reason, it' good to know that we have a voiceso even a no choice vote shows some thanks for their effort. still struggling with new med plan.......i hope we get more info soon,....anyone heard from boatbum?
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Kilo,
I'm still out here in the great frozen west...Have been a little on the busy and preoccupied side recently..Lots going on around here with family and friends...
We got our first major storm of the season about 10 days ago...The local ski area recieved almost 8' of good base snow and opened earlier than any year since '86...What a boost for the local economy...
I was hoping to be in FL before the snow flew this year but didn't make it...Guess I will suffer through at least part of the winter here before we make the move...
You and Allan and I seem to think a lot alike, at least as far as voting on the ARXE issues go...
Just received an email from another retired Xeroid who winters in Ft Myers and he said the weather is absolutely fantastic down there now...Low humidity(for Fl) and temps in the low 80's...It was 19 degrees here this morning...Man, what I would give to be sitting on the beach down there and sipping a cold brewski...
Stay in touch and I'll do the same...
Boatbum
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kilo869 & boatbum .
thanks for the e - mails . hope you guys make it to sun & beaches this winter . i arrived here in kona in my winter condo this last wednesday morning . just returned from a usual morning of surfing .
been haunting the matterofchoice web site for ya , and others , kilo . as soon as they post the choices and prices , i'll let you guys know . hopefully it'll be before the open enrollment period .
thanks for the input here guys . as Red Green says , " i'm pulling for ya . we're all in this together . keep your stick on the ice . "
p.s. the matterofchoice web site is available now but DOES not show our 2005 choices yet . stay tuned .
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IMPORTANT...........IMPORTANT...............IMPORTANT........IMPORTANT..........IMPORTANT
Tne matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) MAY ( see my commentary below ) now be available for 2005 open enrollment . enjoy .
hate to put out conflicting information like this , but after looking at my choices for 2005 and NOT submitting my final choice , i backed out of the matterofchoice web site and called my two friends and told them on the phone about this news . one had received his open enrollment package and the other one didn't yet . after hanging up from those phone conversations i went back on the matterofchoice web site and now the 2005 open enrollment choices AREN'T :blink: there anymore . so i don't know what to tell ya . i'm going back to the site again often this weekend and look at my other choices . once again , stay tuned .
p.s.s. just went back to the web site for the second time and still no 2005 choices . might have been a mistake when i got in the first time ? ? the figures i have written down for the " mod ded united healthcare choice " show me with more than a DOUBLE over my costs last year . from $ 3,196 annually to $ 7,787 annually . i want to go back and compare with a aetna high deductable plan that i am not familar with . ? ? stay tuned .
p.s.s.s. after my fourth attempt this afternoon , the matterofchoice web site now says " unable to access your information " . so it looks like , " we have a problem Houston " on the launch of our open enrollment this year . ? ?
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A.R.X.E 's latest poll results are :
Options proposal is at 173 responses for 42.40%
Severance proposal is at 214 responses for 52.45%
No choice still holding at 21 responses for 5.15%
our choice is pulling ahead as the absentee ballots from the military are being counted kilo869 . :) .
as a update on the matterofchoice web site , i am able to log - in now but no 2005 choices are available yet . must have been a fluke i got in to see my choices that one time yesterday . as a point of reference , the Atena web site shows our xerox 2005 medical plans . you can access it by going to the matterofchoice web site and accessing the xerox 2004 medical plans and then going to the Atena web site where the 2005 xerox medical plans jump right out at ya . more later as i find out information . stay tuned .
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A.R.X.E. posts Premium Payment Options and other useful information . they mention the ADP Benefits Billing Center and links to their web site in their " online resources " .
please see my post of october 26th , 1:35p.m. on this exact topic . and the resulting e - mail exchange between kilo869 and i about logging in and registering on this site to pay and check your medical premiums .
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A.R.X.E.'s poll shows :
Options proposal at 173 responses for 41.59%
Serverance proposal at 217 responses for 53.13%
No choice at 22 responses for 5.29%
we're pulling ahead in the count kilo . they'll probably stop the poll sometime next week .
p.s. don't forget the time changes last nite for most of you folks . in hawaii , where i'm at right now , there is no daylight savings time to change clocks from .
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A.R.X.E. ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) has put out a memo about the Flex Plan Open Enrollment Maximum Contributions .
apparently there is some confusion about the maximum contributions . ARXE says to look on page 27 of your guide for the correct value . those members should log on the ARXE site and check and read this memo if you have any questions .
i am unable to be of much assistense in this because i have moved to my winter home in hawaii and am not likely to receive my enrollment materials for another week or so because of mail forwarding delays .
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for those of you who aren't familar with the Aetna health plans , here is a aetna xerox medical plan web site :
http://custom.aetna.com/xerox/[/url]
i still don't have my enrollment materials yet and still cannot log into the matter of choice web site yet for 2005 choices & prices . but , at least with the above link , i can study the different Aetna xerox plans .
the sneak ( one time only peek ) i got at the prices tells me that the Aetna High Ded Choice POS II - ASC ( for retirees ) is going to be the least expensive plan available .
we all should be able to log on to the matterofchoice web site tomorrow . ? ? stay tuned .
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well , the matterofchoice web site is up and running good . in making and going back and double checking my selections , i was in and out of the site several times so this wasn't a one time ' fluke ' visit for me this morning .
in order to keep my expenses down i switched from Unitedhealth Care to Aetna . by spending quite a bit of time on Aetna / Xerox's web site yesterday i provided above , my Aetna health care coverage card will also be accepted by ALL of my wife's doctors and almost all of mine . the only acception for me is the " gastroenterologist " who gave me a colonoscopy several years ago and who will check me again in a couple of years . all of our same doctors are available on Aetna's " DocFind " on their web site . including the doctor i went to for a centipede bite several years ago here in hawaii .
my annual cost has gone from $ 3,196 with Unitedhealth care , or $ 266 a month to $ 4,397 annually with Aetna or $ 366 a month . this is for Aetna high deductable medical and Metlife dental coverage for myself and my wife . i can see by the selection process where some / many ( ? ) people will select the " accelerated " benefit cause it does save quite bit more . i DID NOT accelerate my benefit . i'll continue to monitor this durning this enrollment process . good luck on your own choices .
p.s. keep in mind when you look at my exact costs that they may differ from yours or others' options cause health care costs really vary regionally . and i'm still amazed at the choices we still have for health care and the different plans xerox has to keep up with . just going through all of Aetna's medical plans available was confusing and complicated . most companies offer one or two plans or " do without " . when i show other retirees from other companies or unions , our xerox retiree health care choices , they are amazed .
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the A.R.X.E. proposal poll continues with :
Option proposal with 176 responses for 40.65%
Severance proposal with 234 responses for 54.04%
No choice is 23 responses for 5.31%
wouldn't be surprised if they close the poll this week cause the voting numbers have definitely slowed down . will update these numbers here durning the day today .
on the national scene , the election is tomorrow and i already absentee voted so we'll all know soon enough how that ballot gos .
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in a recent conversation i had with a xerox retiree , he said that Hewitt told him that when we all received our " confirmation statements " in december as a result of our matterofchoice decisions that we all could possibily see a reduction in the cost totals we saw on our screens during our selection process . here's hoping .
apparently xerox has some last minute calculations / corrections to make before final statements .
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hi allen ,
in a previous post you refer to page 27 of the guide......i'm not sure what guide you're refering to....is it something we recently recieved?
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yes kilo . this is in their post of october 31st where ARXE referred to " page 27 of your enrollment guide " . i will not receive my enrollment package for another few days / weeks due to mail forwarding so you'll have to look at A.R.X.E. 's post of the 31st OR look on page 27 of your enrollment guide you received in your recently received enrollment package .
as soon as i receive my package , i'll look at that page number myself .
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recent results from the A.R.X.E. poll to the xerox board of directors is :
Options proposal is 178 responses for 40.27%
Severance proposal is 240 responses for 54.30%
No choice is 24 responses at 5.43%
wonder when ARXE will shut down their poll and present their proposal to the xerox board . ? ?
i will update this poll during the day to keep the tally current . looks like the national election is over too . hope " your man " won there too . mine did . :) . i'm batting two for two on these ballot issues .
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kilo ,
i have received two e - mails in the last hour alone ( ? ? ) from A.R.X.E. about the october 31st posting of theirs that draws attention to page 27 in the enrollment guide and is a answer to those confused about " maximum contributions " in our open enrollment for next year . i am sending you a separate e - mail with attachments to that memo .
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just received a personal e - mail from my good buddy kilo869 . he said he didn't receive a " guide " yet . and i told him that i haven't even received enrollment materials yet . NO fault of xerox cause i'm in hawaii and my weekly mail forwarding can sometimes turn into several weeks .
i told kilo that the materials and literature weren't necessary for me . that BOTTOM line , insurance for me , was ONLY to pay for those things that i didn't want to or could cover for myself . so i usually always go with the HIGHEST deductable and cheapest plan . told kilo that i was very happy to pay $ 366 a month for medical and dental BOTH for the wife and i . told kilo that i knew friends who were paying TWICE that amount and sometimes EACH . and not have the choices i have .
as big O's friend , clayton , said , " we're covered for another year " . i just hope that some people bite on the " accelerated " benefit so it'll take some of the pressure off xerox on their post - 65 care and allow xerox to continue to pay for me forever . :) .
FYI , if any of ya send a personal e - mail to me , i will usually respond on line here too cause i feel open discussions are educational . unless you request otherwise in your e - mail .
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just received a e - mail from kilo that he received his " guide " . so he can now better decide for himself what plan is best for his family . we also discussed retiring in hawaii and i mentioned his , and boatbum's , plans to retire in florida . B) .
thanked kilo for his input here on xertech . helps us all to share our personal thoughts and feelings i think .
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hi allen,
just read in Men's Health tha Hawaii is one of the healthiest places to live, so i guess you're making a good choice. i go quarterly for cholesterol testing, and that ain't cheap but the coverage good, just hope it continues...
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After reading about your benifit package and the cost I feel blessed as I took the pakage here in Canada in 1994 and I don't pay for anything and only pay the tax on it as a taxable benifit
BOB L
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kilo ,
hawaii is susposed to have the longest lived people of any state ( ? ? ) . not sure that's true . but i do believe the " very even " weather ( here in kailua-kona , it doesn't ever get much below 65 degrees or above 90 degrees - year round and generally there's a trade wind blowing all the time ) . kona weather is described as " eternal spring " year round . course the culture ( oriental backround ) probably has something to do with the long lives too ? ? . and lastly , the culture over here is most of the locals don't give a darn about much . sun , sand , beach , waves , wahines , cold beer , surfing ( i surf every morning here - just got back ) , etc seems to be the order of the day over here . my hula kumu ( teacher ) says when they solve all of the world's problems , it'll come down to one word : ALOHA .
i hope the coverage continues too kilo . after medicare kicks in post - 65 , it'll be less of a concern i think / hope . ? ?
thanks for sharing . stay in touch .
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BOB L ,
thanks for sharing with us how things are in the great white north . helps others to see how the world works .
you probably know who Red Green is and all that stuff about keeping your stick on the ice . eh ? ?
living in alaska for almost 40 years , i've been through Canada a few times . beautiful country . especially the further north reaches where i frequent - Yukon , and B.C.
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received another personal e - mail from kilo869 . he noticed in the October " You & Xerox " where his maximum contribution for lo - med is $ 4,000 . and i told him that page eight ( 8 ) mentioned the maximum contribution ( payment ) costs per plan .
told kilo that i already had this discussion with another rep and we figured that we would wait for our mid december confirmation statement to see what our actual costs were .
told kilo that i was happy paying the premium i saw on my enrollment screen and that , of course , i would be happier paying less . :) .
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Hi Al, I was reviewing my medical options , all I can say is ,where' s the promise??. While employed I was paying $58.70 amonth, I retired in June 2004, it jumped to $216.67 a month, and for the year 2005, $547.50. Simple math says I am giving back 20% of my retirement check, and that is before taxes. Any way I look at, it stinks... jfs
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hi ifs ,
no one - no company can afford " the promise " . years ago , not just xerox , but other companies " promised " medical care coverage . some of those companies have gone bankrupt trying to deliver " the promise " . some of those companies that had union contracts with unions that didn't see that this age of expensive medical care IS NOT the fault of these companies tried to make the companies deliver " the promise " and in the end they mostly went out of business or no longer offer " the promise " .
health care costs are a NATIONAL issue . and certainly xerox , or any other company had any idea that BENEFITS ( health care coverage , company car , training , retirement / pension , etc ) would end up costing the company more than wages now . people who hire on with xerox right now WILL NOT have health care coverage allowances ( none - nada ) paid in retirement later and will pay full price unlike us now . people who hire on with xerox right now will not have the " higher of the three " pension options that many of us had and xerox certainly delivered to many of you who left under early out programs . and xerox didn't have to do that . they could have issued us " pink slips " and said , " thanks and good bye " . xerox spent many millions on early out programs trying to deliver " the promise " .
in addition , no government can afford " the promise " . social security - medicare - those government " promises " will not be available to future retirees in the same amount or in the same fashion as now . or certainly not according to " the promise " .
i don't like paying the health care cost increases any more than you do . but , i also know that xerox trying to deliver " the promise " is offering me health care for ONE THIRD to ONE HALF the cost my retired friends pay for health care coverage for other companies / unions that didn't try to deliver " the promise " .
bottom line is . " if you think you can deliver ' the promise ' by going out on the open insurance market and getting your own health care cheaper , go ahead " . i know for a fact that i can't . and my retired friends that have " no promise " are paying anywhere from $ 500 a month EACH to a thousand a month ( $ 1,000 ) EACH or combined and don't like their choices . because they have no other choices because there is " no promise " . my monthly cost went from $ 266 a month last year to $ 366 a month next year for medical and dental both for the wife and me because of the choices xerox provided me in attempting to deliver " the promise " .
i just pray to god that xerox can continue to deliver " the promise " such as they are doing now . but , i don't expect it . and i certainly don't expect xerox to go out of business trying and have to fire all the current people gainfully employed there now . and i also don't expect the government to fix anything either . in the end the only " promise " that's any good is the one each of us has to make to ourself to plan and provide for our own retirement . if we all PRETEND the " promise " isn't there , we'd all be much happier with what we're provided .
and p.s. ifs , if you think it stinks now , it's going to get alot more smelly later in 5 to 10 years without some major reform in the way we deliver health care , social security , medicare , and " the promise " in this country . :) . one third to one half of the social security increases next year went to pay for medicare / medigap cost increases .
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on the A.R.X.E. site , the ballot count is :
Options proposal = 182 votes for 40.18%
Severance proposal = 247 votes for 54.43%
No choice is holding at 24 votes for 5.30%
i'll update this during the day .
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the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) has a new " question of the month " when you get past the log - in screen . it has to do with " Maximum Contributions " . there is a two question and answer series that explains that " maximum contributions " is the amount or premium we pay for health care coverage . and that the final total we see on our " work sheet " may not reflect the true total after a " adjustment " is made for various factors . refers to page 27 again in the guide .
you can log back on to matterofchoice kilo and read this FAQ . and ifs , your damages , and most others , might not be as bad as the work sheet says .
apparently the confirmation we will receive in mid december will be accurate and possibily lower . :)
for myself , i just wanted to confirm that my 2005 summery was as i selected earlier .
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i'm not wild about the rising cost of our premiums, but the whole health care world has gone crazy, if you think we have it bad look at other retirees, and if they think they've got it bad, try socialized medicine
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amen kilo ,
and for those less well educated as to the cost of health care , i received a personal e - mail from my good buddy kilo869 where he had dinner recently with a friend who is a EMC early retiree ( 52 ) , who has NO health care offered as a retiree . his personal private health care is " costing him $ 1,450 a month.......now i feel better " .
i thanked kilo for sharing that with me in my reply to him . my research ( and i personally read 10 to 20 or more times the material i post here on xertech ) indicates that that is more the norm than we might believe , not the exception . on a recent call in investment radio program , they got ' off topic ' awhile and most of the callers were paying from a grand to a grand and a half a month ( $ 1k to $ 1.5k ) .
that's not to say that we , as retirees , shouldn't hold xerox's feet to the fire on our retiree health care costs . but we must be careful not to kill the goose that's attempting to honor " the promise " .
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A.R.X.E. in their attempt to hold xerox's " feet to the fire " on our retiree health care costs closed their poll last nite . they thanked the 453 members for participating and the outcome was :
Options = 40.2%
Severance = 54.5%
No choice = 5.3%
A.R.X.E. will put the proposal together as soon as possible for submission to the board . Verizon , Bank of America , and Norfolk Southern are among a few of the other companies who have similar proposals before their boards .
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received my own " Personal Enrollment Materials " yesterday in my forwarded mail . got my 64 page " 2005 Retiree Flex Enrollment Guide " too . what was interesting about my hard copy of my " worksheet " was that my default if i did nothing was what i picked anyway . and out of a total of seven ( 7 ) medical plans and three ( 3 ) dental , i thought that was ironic .
now i have some reference materials to look at for this next year ( 2005 ) . by now most of you should have received your enrollment materials and have until november 20th to submit your choices . otherwise , you can do as i did , and just go onto matterofchoice ( http://www.matterofchoice.com ) and make your selections .
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random observations after reading my 64 page " 2005 Retiree Flex Enrollment Guide " :
1) xerox doesn't offer the new Health Savings Accounts yet for 2005 , but they will meet the federal guidelines for such in case they decide to do so . don't think these federal guidelines have been firmly established yet . ? ? Bush is still trying to get these things through Congress , i think . ? ?
2) under the High Deductable Aetna plan , " the ENTIRE family deductable must be met before the plan pays any benefits " .
3) " Under the Aetna DMO , you must use a dentist who participates in the plan - otherwise no benefits are payable " .
4) Medicare : " You must elect or continue to elect coverage under Medicare Parts A and B " . " If you decide to purchase a non - Xerox sponsored post - 65 health plan ( e.g. , directly through an insurance company with no assistance from Xerox . ) , you must waive your coverage under the Xerox plan ( i.e. . elect " No Coverage " . ) .
5) Pre - existing Condition Limits = none
6) Lifetime Maximum Benefits = none ( as a note here , some of my friends have a million dollar lifetime limit . a very few who have serious multiple problems are HALF way through their limit . what happens then . ? ? )
7) LifeCycle Allowance . " For participants who retired prior to 1/1/2003 , it continues for the lifetime of..........the retirees spouse / domestic partner upon the retiree's death " . certainly a " promise " my wife will look forward to . :) .
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A.R.X.E ( association of retired xerox employees ) http://www.arxe.org[/url] posts a statement from xerox regarding Blood Pressure Screening :
" from Xerox's perspective , a simple blood pressure screening ' on it's own ' is preventive care and should be covered under the co - pay plan " .
" Unfortunately this is not available now and may not be available for some time " . " Blood pressure screening is part of a eligible annual physical " .
my take on all this is to buy yourself your own cuff and measure your own blood pressure whenever you feel like it . better & cheaper for ya . i have several compact ones that i use frequently . more details on ARXE's site .
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Allan,
I have an even better solution for blood pressure screening...
Marry a nurse, like I was smart enough to do almost 25 years ago..
There are all sorts of "freebie" medical perks that come with the territory on that one, like my internist who doesn't start "collecting real money" till my deductible is paid (on paper) and then accepts whatever the insurance pays as "paid in full"...Kinda' like getting free health care...Of course it also helps that my internist is also my fishing and bird hunting buddy...
Boatbum
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know what you mean boatbum . my wife worked many years in hospitals as a lab tech . mostly blood work . i usually go to the local health fairs and order a full panel of blood tests for cheap and my wife translates the results for me . plus she's a " health nut " and makes sure i eat all the correct foods and stuff .
that and a exercise program since i retired of plenty of walking , NO elevators ( use stairs always ) , very little driving , and surfing and swimming over here in hawaii makes for a healthy retirement .
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hey boatbum,
i too married a nurse, i get good medical care, but not a lot af sympathy. i'm curious how the deductable will work out on the new plan, i don't think my doctor is inclined to give me a break.
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my personal experience with ' deductables ' is the same as yours kilo . in years past when i first retired , the doctor / clinic could ' code ' the claim just right and often times xerox / unitedhealth care would pick up part of it . this year and i'm sure in the future with more attention being paid to deductables and maximums being paid before your coverage starts , that'll be a thing of the past .
and it's just as well with me . i have health care coverage for those really big ticket items that could really ruin a guy's retirement assets . the couple thousand a year in incidential health care costs , i would just as soon pay for myself than to expect xerox to do so and possibily not be able to afford to offer me any retiree health care coverage at all . the several thousand a year i save by going with the highest deductable / cheapest medical plan they offer is the money i'll spend on myself and my wife every year for those things that i consider important .
p.s. because my wife is so knowledgeable about what i eat and am not supposed to eat and the way i act ; i , too , have little sympathy when i don't do right . :) .
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today is the one year anniversary of the start of this " Retiree News " forum . in this period , we have gotten over seven thousand hits for a daily adverage of almost twenty a day - every day of the year - including weekends & holidays . would like to thank all those who have contributed their thoughts and posts to the mix - you're getting too numerous to be mentioned individually . hopefully we'll have another successful year bringing this forum before tech reps . also thanks to xertech for putting this web site before us xeroids as a place for us to document our successes and opportunities .
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hey allen,
just heard 14 more irif's from my old district, and it sounds like active employees are getting a bump in insurance too
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thanks for the input kilo . especially on the irif's . and A.R.X.E. told us that current employees were going to have the same similar increases in their health care costs as us retirees . and even more so that they would have their deductables tied to their income . so , the more they make , the higher their deductable before xerox medical coverage begins to pick up the cost .
using that logic . the health care costs will be more progressive and the rich will also pay more for their coverage . only problem using that logic is some of us are rich and don't know it yet . :) .
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Allan,
I had the opportunity to go over the Open Enrollment choices with an active employee this week...You are right, their choices are basically the same as ours and the deductibles are directly tied to their annual base salary...On the low deductible option it is 2% and on the moderate it was 4% and then it was 80% and 20% payment...
The young fellow I was helping is single and a "not too highly paid CSE" because he came over from the Service Agent program...I think his annual gross is just over $30K and he signed up for the Blue Cross/Blue Shield moderate deductible option and his deductible was just under $1300 and his "per pay period before tax bite" went up about $25.00 per pay period...
Boatbum
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thanks for sharing boatbum . it's part of the new medical cost containment process that people who use the care in fact pay for it . and those that earn more , pay more .
in the old days everybody paid the same weither you used it or not . and everybody paid the same weither you has kids , a wife or not . not anymore . in the future if you use the care , you're going to pay for it . a minimum co - pay is a thing of the past .
at this point , the only way the goverment and companies figure they can cut back on health care costs is to cut back on people submitting themselves for care for every little thing . now , if you pay full price for the first few things , you'll think twice before requesting care .
and in the end , the result won't be harmful . cause if you're truely sick and you begin to run up your costs quickly , you'll be beyond your deductable fairly quickly and they'll pick up from 80% to 100% anyway . one friend i know had a $ 17k ER bill for a over nite cause she had a reaction to a carpet cleaner / rinse that was used on her carpets by a professional cleaner and stopped breathing several times before thay could stablize her ( how would a person know ? ? ) . and my old manager took the afternoon off from his busy day of hearing customer complaints about service and went in for a heart stress test and felt fine and came out the following morning with a stent and a $ 35k bill . and , of course Blue Cross picked up most of it , and that tech will never ever again complain about a single xerox increase for medical coverage again . ever . even if they doubled and quadrupled the coverage costs cause he's over $ 35k ahead now . and my best friend had a prostrate test when i did and his PSA number was much higher than mine . and now here two years later , surgery and radiation and about $ 45k . and of course , Blue Cross picked up almost all of that .
complaints . hell no . these people are tickled to death to get coverage at any price . matter of fact , with pre - conditions and all , these people probably could not obtain coverage anywhere else at any price .
but i won't bore you with the stories . anyone that bothers to spend the time to research and learn this stuff can figure out the facts too .
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the xerox Benefits Resources site ( http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url] ) has new fund profiles maintained by Morningstar Inc . log on if you still have a account over there and check it out . morningstar , of course , is the famous mutual fund rating source . they're know for their " five star " rating system .
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the " question of the month " on the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) has changed to a reminder that today at 5:00 P.M. CST the open enrollment period is over .
you might want to log - on and verify your 2005 choices as i just did cause it's really difficult to get a real person later on that knows how to undo what the computer has in it now . easier now than later .
we should get our comfirmation statements next month with our real cost break down .
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A.R.X.E. posted a letter from Lawrence M Becker , Director of Corporate Benefits , " Xerox responds to Active Employees outrage on 2005 costs " on their web site : ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) .
this is a 16 part question and answer series to current employees that us retirees might be interested in reading .
xerox is extending active xerox salaried and XGS , Inc employees open enrollment til november 23rd next week and will be holding round tables with employees giving them more information .
suggest those of us who are retirees and members of ARXE might want to log on and see what the ' field ' has to pay . i would have to say after reading the details of the question and answer series , we , as retirees , certainly aren't being treated any worse than the current employees .
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received in my forwarded ( you guys should have already gotten this since my mail takes awhile to be forwarded to me ) mail today a copy of " Meet the Health Plans : " ( summary of services provided through our health plans ) . this is a 15 page color brochure with most of the plans in it .
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Allen my dad is retired from us air what is going to happen to his retiree benefits
and where can i go to help him understand more of what he has to do.
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hi duanew ,
the easiest way to follow company news about anything about that company be it their bond rating or pensions or anything is to plug their stock ticker symbol in your favorite financial search engine and follow it daily . and i do mean daily . in your dad's case the ticker symbol is UAIRQ.OB
as a example here is a link from yahoo's financial links : ( http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=uairq.ob[/url] ) . by the way , when you see a stock ticker symbol with that many letters in it , it isn't a good sign that the company is doing well . usually it's a sign the company is in serious trouble . and certainly at a last traded price of 88 cents a share , that isn't a good sign either . :( .
at any rate , you update that link often and read all the news that's fit to print about that company . and check each and every link under the " Headlines " and " Reports " on that web page . to not do so lets trouble slide under the door without your being aware of it . and in your dad's case , that ignorance could be very costly if he had a quick decision to make as regards a lump sum payout option or whatever on his pension choices . put lots of paper in your printer and start a file folder . really . you'll be glad you did later cause most of these links disappear after awhile . but , of course , the problem usually doesn't disappear or get resolved so quickly .
i will focus more on U.S. Airlines now that i know we have a especially interested party . thanks for providing us with a place here to allow this kind of conversation . helps us all i think .
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duanew ,
in the stock market , good companies and their stocks , just like ' cream ' , tends to raise to the top . keeping that in mind , i did a study of US Airways compared to other airlines in their industry using technical analysis tools available to investors and possible share holders and came up with the following analysis : http://finance.yahoo.com/q/in?s=UAIRQ.OB
if you notice under the " Top Airline Companies by Market Cap " , you'll see that US Airways is at the bottom of most of the group with NO P/E , which is a price / earning ratio ( price divided by earnings expressed as a nunber ) measurement tool . and with no earnings , you can't have a P/E .
also if you notice under the next table of " UAIRQ.OB vs Industry Leaders " that US Airways Group Inc doesn't fare well either .
there is a weeding out process going on now in the airlines industry just like there was in the steel industry years ago . there will be fewer airlines next year , 2005 , than there is this year . and fewer in following years , 2006 and beyond , than there is now . given that according to my studies there will be a increase going forward in the price of oil , look at what europe pays for their gasoline , and luxury travel , even and especially corporate travel , is probably going to be ever tied to corporate costs and to terrorism in the future , there isn't going to be a future need for more airlines and growth . although a good airlines WITHOUT " expensive " labor contracts and employee benefit programs can make money - look at Southwest Airlines ( stock ticker symbol - LUV ) .
if i can be of further assistence , let me know Duanew . otherwise , your dad should just attempt to keep himself up to date with the forces beyond his and your control . my grandfather was a " railroad engineer " at a time when that was the " airline pilot " of our recent past . it used to be the highest paying and most responsible job there was . now . ? ?
if i come across anything new regarding US Airways in my search for news for retirees , i'll be sure to include it too . thanks for asking me to update you and your dad on this topic . i , and i'm sure others here , learned alot . and once again , thanks from me and others here for helping to provide a place where this type of information sharing can take place .
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hi allen,
i'm amazed at the number of companies that are included in the pbgc web site, anyhoo, happy thanksgiving to you, boatbum,duanew and all the others following this web site
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not only am i amazed at the number now kilo , but also at the rate of growth . at this rate , most of all of the corporate retirees that don't take lump sums will be paid their pensions by the government .
one reason i advise to take your lump sum and get it in your own hands . cause if you're going to give it to a company in lieu of a lump sum for a pension , you'll always wonder what the heck'll happen later .
also was amazed at the complexity of the calculation required to figure out what part of what you thought you were going to get , that you aren't going to get . :blink: . and if i read correctly , there was a " give back " calculation on any over payment ( ? ? ) that a retiree might have gotten before his pension plan was taken over by PBGC . ? ?
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man allen u really came threw for me i thank u so much
have a happy Thankgiving
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no problem duanew . thanks for coming ' threw ' for us and giving us a place to information share all this kind of stuff . hope your holidays are good too . let me know if you or your dad need any other assistense .
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first news report this morning said almost 100 Delta pilots expected to retire . then the next news report was over 100 . then the news said almost 200 .
final news report tonite at 7:17 p.m. est said 229 .
i'll try to get a good link tomorrow on the final exact number . smart guys and gals to me .
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sounds like their retirement will take a big hit if they stay at reduced wages
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that's why the smart ones are leaving now kilo . their highest years are counted towards their lump sum / pension payouts too . after the pay reduction takes effect this month , their pay ain't ever going to get higher in the future . thus making sure their lump sum / pension payouts will get smaller and smaller as these lower years upcoming get added into their last highest paid years .
it's just a matter of whipping a pencil to a blank sheet of paper and figuring that NOW is the time .
highest number of pilots i've gotten so far was the last number of 229 i saw . and if i were them , i'd dang sure take that 50% lump sum offering that's in their rules . cause the pension later could be through the pension benefit guarantee corporation and i don't like the way they calculate the higher pension deduction amounts . take the lump sum , bank it , and make your own pension down the road .
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definitely grab that lump sum...there should be no crying in retirement and by having control of your assets is the surest way to retire the way that's most comfortable for the individual (see Beta factor). I don't have your financial expertise but I knew enough to hire someone who did, and have been happy with the results (his commission is based on my earnings).
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agree with you about the lump sum kilo . not so sure i agree about the financial expertise . i just don't trust anybody else . too many horror stories about people putting their trust in a money manager and find their hard ( really difficult now to get it back in this secular bear market we're in ) earned retirement monies gone . happens all the time . even among relatives and friends .
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thoughts on Social Security :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/74225/1035803[/url]
course , this isn't the opinion of suite101 , Normxxx , Xertech , or myself . this is only for educational purposes and food for thought . :) .
most of the members of this forum will probably get their social security according to the rules presently in effect now . but later , especially much later for those younger than 50 right now , there will have a different system i'm sure .
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like to call to the attention of the readers of this forum , the start of a new topic ( Sale of Xerox Service ) on the Coffee House forum . this would bring xerox full circle with the sale of manufacturing , outsourcing of sales and parts . xerox will only design the box . they won't make it , sell it , or now service it in the future IF THIS IS TRUE .
this also really opens the door on retiree benefits . who would be responsibile for the liability of the payment of these benefits going forward . ? ?
i used to own Danka shares years ago when i used to trade individual stocks . it was one of my few losing trades :) . here's a link for their stock for those who want to track their financial news and stock price going forward : http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=danky
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the question of the month of the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) has changed to :
Q. Can i pay my invoice online ?
the answer is given in a one page pdf. format file under the frequently asked questions tab on the top page header . a link is given to the ADP web site already given here on this forum on october 26th , 1:35p.m. along with specific instructions how to create a account and log - on .
i just came from the site and there isn't anything beyond this year ( 2004 ) to look at yet . stay tuned .
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Hi Al, As for the direction of retirement benefits, Check back to Jan. 2002, the Polaroid Company's Retirement Plan. It was one of the first things dropped. Get ready for a bumpy ride. If the company is sold, the old retired workers don't mean much to the new owners..
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Just wanted to let everyone know that the retiree confirmation statements are all out and bunches of them have mistakes as far as how much the retiree's monthly share is going to be..
I received mine earlier in the week and got all excited because the bottom line showed my monthly to ADP was to be a big fat 0...After checking it over several times I found the mistake was that I had gotten allowances for both me and my wife but was only being charged for one premium...I called Hewitt the following morning and the very helpful lady that I spoke with stated that Xerox was aware of the mistake and corrected confirmation statements will be forthcoming.. :(
Shoot, I thought maybe Anne was taking pity on me and picking up my share out of her bonus.. B)
Boatbum
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i couldn't agree with you more ifs . one of the reasons corporations sell off a part of their business is they usually get cash or shares in the company that is purchasing that part of the busines ( these shares can be the same as cash later , especially if those share prices increase ) , BUT the selling company also relieves themselves of the LIABILITY and present expense of those employees and especially their pension and retiree benefits later such as healthcare .
yes , ifs , you're so right . unfortunately . :( .
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really appreciate your post boatbum that the confirmation statements may not be correct . myself , and xertech too i'm sure , welcome any and all input here on this forum , weither it's " off topic " or not . the more input here , the better . helps us all when we're trying to figure out which way this old world's " curve balls " are headed . being " blind sided " is the worst of retirement planning circumstances .
p.s. next time you're talking to Anne about her bonus boatbum , be sure to mention my name too . :) . don't forget it's ' allan ' with two ' L ' s
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the question of the month at matter of choice ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) has changed again . apparently due to open enrollment , there will not be a invoice for medical coverage sent in december . you will be billed for January and February for the coverage period of January 1st through February 28th .
there will be a letter mailed on tuesday , december 14th to explain this issue . if you have any questions , please log on to the matter of choice . com link above . there will be a extended grace period for the above payment .
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A.R.X.E. send out a memo on the delayed billing on the January payment of the Flex Plan Benefit . see my post above also . the billing / coupon will be sent out about January 7th and will be due February 1st . it will cover the two month period . for more information , log on to : http://www.arxe.org
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for those of you interested in seeing your final number for your health care costs , mine are now available at ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) . my total annual cost moved from $ 4,397.00 to $ 3,569.00 . or $ 297.41 a month . of course your costs may vary depending on your plan you choose and circumstances that are special to you . my preminum payment last year was $ 266.33 a month . so i personally can't complain about this year's increase . :) . now i just have to keep in mind boatbum's post of december 11th that some confirmation statements were wrong .
suggest if you haven't received your final confirmation letter as i haven't yet , that you can go to the matterofchoice web site and check your numbers out there .
i intend to attempt to make again one single payment for my whole year's preminum in january . i don't want to worry about missing a preminum payment next year . i'll let you know if i succeed .
p.s. well , for me ifs , the ' promise ' is still being kept . i just wish xerox the best in being able to continue that ' promise ' another year in 2006 when open enrollment comes around next fall .
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for those of ya who want to check out the web site of your medical plan provider , you might want to attempt to registar on their web site and log - in and create a personalized account . my primary plan provider is now Aetna and they now know who i am and most of my data was already ( spouse's name and birthday for example ) there .
they warned me that some of the site links were not available to me yet cause my coverage doesn't start until 1 / 01 / 2005 . but you can check out other things such as primary doctors and clinics and hospitals available to you in your area . one of the reasons i switched from United Healthcare to Aetna was because i can keep alot of my same doctors and clinics under their plan . the only thing that really changes for me is their primary hospital which in my area is no big deal cause we really only have two major hospitals and most doctors in my area are registered to provide their services in either hospital and most doctors in my area ask each of their patients where they want a particular procedure ( such as a colonoscopy ) done . while i'm on the subject of colonoscopy , i had one done several years ago and have a second follow up scheduled in the future . i have colon cancer in my family . i don't have it , but it's alot easier getting checked before you have a problem until waiting until it's serious enough to take your colon taken out . :( .
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Allan,
I received the corrected benefits statement on Friday...My wife and I opted for the "Low Deductible Blue Cross Blue Shield option, along with MetLife Dental..My total annual adjusted contribution is $4,621, or $385.08 monthly...
As I have stated before, the tab for Pat's bout with breast cancer has reached almost $225,000 and my total out of pocket expense has been $600...I will never quibble about the medical premium...Even though it hurts to write that check each month it is something that none of us can afford to be without..
I was in Las Vegas this weekend to visit my Mom and to take my wife to the airport to catch a flight to FL to visit with her Mom and to do some serious house hunting while she is there...After my brother and I dropped Pat at the airport we were doing some additional Christmas shopping and bumped in to the wife of one of my ex-bosses who took early reitrement several years ago...He opted out of the Xerox retiree insurance program and she is still working so they will have some coverage...It is a shame that some of us have to continue to slave away because to quit or retire would mean giving up the insurance coverage..
Boatbum
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hi boatbum ,
nice to hear from you again . appreciate your honest actual numbers . i think it helps others to see where their own numbers stand in relationship to others . if i had a serious medical problem as your family and one of my best xeroid retired friends does , i too , would pick a lower deductable retiree health care plan . but , because i've been fortunate so far in my life with my good health , i can choose the highest deductable plan choice available to me and feel safe . one of the really nice things about xerox's retiree health care coverage plans is the choices i have . if i ever need it , i can always select a plan next year that better suits me .
i agree with you about xerox's retiree health care coverage . it is my best retiree benefit . and i have heard stories from retired friends who have to continue working for some kind of health care coverage . and sometimes it isn't the best coverage . nor do they often have any choices . it's either this or nada . :( .
good luck on your serious house hunting in florida . i really enjoy my time here in hawaii right now where i've been posting since late october . i particularily enjoy surfing every day here and being able to maintain a good exercise program in the ever pleasant weather here in kailua - kona on the big island instead of ice , snow , and cold of the great white north of home in alaska this time of year .
once again appreciate your input here . helps to educate others that my posting isn't just my own bent toward ' rah -rah ' xerox . but that my posting here is a look at the facts and trying to pick the best out of all of our retiree choices , be it investments or other retiree choices such as health care .
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just received in my forwarded mail , my 2005 benefits decision confirmation statement . xerox isn't to be blamed for my late receipt of this statement as my forwarded mail can take weeks . my confirmation statement agrees with my matterofchoice screen selection . now that i have this in hand , i will make a copy and contact ADP Benedirect by certified / return receipt mail to set up a one time payment in january for my 2005 medical coverage . let you know how it gos .
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also received in my forwarded mail a " Summary Annual Report " of Xerox Benefit Plans from Lawrence M. Becker for calendar year 2003 ( ? ? ) . this is a ten ( 10 ) page listing , including a two page cover letter and list of plans , for 12 pages in all , dated november , 2004 of all the benefit plans that xerox is responsible for . there were 54 insurance providers alone including 23 other pension and benefit plans . wow . it's basicly a bunch of brief finanical statements . money in - money out for each plan . some are union benefit plans . most are not .
i'd say , ifs , that xerox is attempting to keep the promise . certainly wish xerox luck in maintaining all these different plans and paying all these different insurance carriers . lots of people involved , current employees and retirees , union and otherwise . i can imagine the cost of the corporate staff alone just to keep all these different plans separate and up todate . much less the funding necessary to pay for it all . i can see why the airlines , or other companies if they can , would want to get out of it and drop the whole mess . not to mention getting sued by a participant or participants ( class action ) if you make one wrong calculation in one lumpsum payoff .
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those nitwits forget that us air, like xerox, is not the only show in town and like you say, if you only fly a couple of times a year you will remember who treated you like luggage
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sounds like you were treated like baggage over the holidays kilo869 . ? :) ?
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also received in my forwarded mail today a written notification dated december 14th from the Xerox Benefits Center of the delayed billing for the january / february medical preminum time frame . we can expect to be billed on or about january 7th , 2005 with a due date of february 1st , 2005 . and a grace period of april 1st , 2005 .
i intend to contact the ADP people the beginning of next year ( 2005 ) with my request for a single payment for my entire year's medical coverage . i'll let you know how that effort gos at that time .
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the Association of Retired Xerox Employees has a good article on their web site http://www.arxe.org[/url] about the xerox healh care costs . this article is by Ellen Schultz dated december 30th on the Wall Street Journal and it's impossible to get a link to that article without a membership fee so those of you who belong might want to log into the A.R.X.E. site and read the article .
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is this the future ? :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/82399/1042792[/url]
course , this isn't the opinion of myself , xertech.org , Normxxx , or suite101 . but it sure gives one alot of food for thought . i'm very glad to be permanently out of the job market . retirement does have it's rewards . :) .
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really appreciate your getting a link to this article tatkins . this is the article i made reference to on the A.R.X.E web site in my december 31st post . only i couldn't get a good link to it . thanks for sharing for those who aren't A.R.X.E. members and can access this article there . :) .
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i just came from the ADP BeneDirect web site where we can make medical coverage payments on line . and they show my account as being current now . they show my monthly preminum payment amount as being accurate and they also allow a full 12 month's payment period ( which i am very happy about :) ) , which means i don't need a special dispensation from the pope to be able to do that . BUT , the payment amount for that full year is much more than my monthly preminum payment times 12 months . even including the $10 convenience charge . i couldn't contact them by e - mail today and i also couldn't go further into the payment screen .
will try again tomorrow . you might log on to the ADP BeneDirect web site and create a account and a personal profile . there is a link to the web site along with specific step by step instructions on how to log - on and create a account in my october 26th post at 1:35p.m. it's on page 25 of this archived ( thank you xertech :) ) forum .
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just came from the ADP BeneDirect web site again and their preminum pay link still doesn't work yet ( gives a error screen ) , so they still aren't set up for online payment yet . and i left a e - mail message with them regarding why there is much more than the listed $ 10 service charge when i want to pay on line .
will check back with them later and maybe give them a phone call later this week . stay tuned . if i'm having difficulties , others are too . :( . at least they are set up to accept a full year's preminum payment if we can agree on that dollar amount . ? ?
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would like to call your attention to a new topic under the " Xerox " forum . the topic title is : " 3rd Party service..opinions? " . Derek has some excellent questions he'd like answered and i'm sure some of the readers of my forum can assist him .
and by the way , Derek is our newest registered member and i'd like to extend him a personal welcome to the xertech web site and hope he finds solutions to his problems . a happy customer :) is our goal here .
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pensions dwindle :
http://www.abcnews.go.com/Business/print?id=86655[/url]
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i received in my mail box my Aetna healthcare coverage card and my Caremark drug card . thank you xerox . as i get older , these are like ' gold ' . Clayton , who is a friend of big ' O ' uses the Caremark card and loves it . he can get a three month drug prescription instead of a thirty day one from a drug store . plus it's sent to his home . and it's cheaper . i'm not on any prescription medication ( thank you lord :) ) , but those that are say that Caremark is a good deal .
i will cut up my old UnitedHealthcare card from last year and last year's Caremark card ( that happens to have the exact same codes on it ) .
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received a e - mail reply from the ADP BeneDirect ( Automatic Data Processing ) people who handle the medical preminum payments for xerox and they didn't have a good answer for the numbers on my account in their data base , but they did agree with the annual preminum amount total due . the e - mail did say i could make a full year's payment and just write that on the check so i will wait for my first invoice that i should receive shortly and attach my large check to it and sent it back to them certified / return receipt mail .
i just visited the ADP web site and now my account looks different again than what it did on my last visit there . if my numbers are not correct , others will have the same problems too . stay tuned .
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caremark is a real moneysaver, my wife and i have a couple of presriptions, if you can get a generic you can really save, i don't know what we'ed do if we paid full price
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appreciate your input kilo . i think xerox has to pay extra to include us under that CareMark coverage . a lady friend of mine had the option of going with AARP medigap coverage with UnitedHealthcare that DID NOT include the CareMark drug package . she also had the option of almost the exact same plan with UnitedHealthcare under the xerox coverage and our UnitedHealthcare medicare post - 65 coverage INCLUDES CareMark i think . that lady is going to miss that CareMark coverage later i think . :( .
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xerox announces a new health care account claims administrator starting in 2005 . ADP Benefit Services will administer the claims for the Salary Redirection Health Care Account and Dependent Care Account .
more details at : http://www.arxe.org[/url]
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well it may keep companies from dipping into retirement funds every time they need cash. as for caremark, i am counting on the post-65 coverage. you don't have to be very sick to run up a big pharmacy, and once you start taking blood pressure or cholesterol medication it's usualy for life.
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you're right kilo , making the ' bad ' companies pay more is a huge step in the right direction . in the past the bad companies got away with screwing with their pension plans .
and , like you , i'm counting on xerox to provide for my post - 65 medical coverage and like you i hope that includes something like CareMark drug coverage . and , by the way , Aetna offers a discount drug / pharmacy coverage as a part of their high - deductable plan too . i haven't checked out the details because it probably already duplicates my CareMark coverage , but it is nice to know . and , to my knowledge , our post - 65 coverage will be through UnitedHealthcare anyway . but , who knows by the time we're 65 . ? ?
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received in my snail mail this morning my first invoice for 2005 for my xerox retiree medical coverage from ADP Benefit Services . the invoiced time frame is for THREE months instead of TWO months as we were lead to believe .
i just came from the ADP Benedirect web site to attempt to pay on line again and their annual number for a 12 month preminum payment still does not agree with my annual costs . so i intend to send my full annual payment with the coupon i received today along with a copy of the e - mail i received from ADP Benedirect where they confirmed that i could pay for 12 months and they agreed on my annual figure .
i will send it certified - return receipt snail mail today . let you know how it gos . stay tuned .
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the association of retired xerox employees just put out the word that the three month billing we just received from ADP was in ERROR and that a new two month invoice would be sent out shortly .
for me , it's of little importance cause i've already sent out my check for the whole of next year ( see post above ) anyway . and i just as soon do that as get tangled up in their billing errors anyway all durning the year . :) .
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the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) is now putting out the same information in their " question of the month " after you log in as A.R.X.E. posted on the error on the three month flex retiree medical billing we just received . we / you will be rebilled for the correct two month time frame shortly .
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hi allen,
just dropped payment in the mailbox this am........took the mod deductable and saved $200 over last year, but i'm wondering if i shold have gone low deductable, oh well i'll find out when the bills come in!
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that's the biggest question mark in chosing your plan kilo that'll best suit you for the coming year . it's difficult to really know if the plan you selected is the right one until the year's bills are complete .
that's one of the really nice things about having lots of choices . most retirees i know with other companies and municiplilities / states / other goverment pension plans DO NOT have all these different choices and have them every year in be able to change according to their changing needs . most retirees i know have NO retiree medical choices or just one plan - period .
course , later on when we're post - 65 , those choices will go away as we move into our final medicare / medigap plan selection . after that , we're locked in forever .
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would like to bring to the attention of the readers of my forum a new topic under the " General Discussions , Humor , Rants , etc " forum . it's called the " INDEPENDENT SERVICE ORGANIZATIONS - Forming A new Association " started by ' Tech Rep ' .
possiblly some of ya would like to take part and help make this thing a go . KT has already put in his two cents for a name for the association . :) . Tech Rep left a e - mail address to get ahold of him .
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i just checked on the ADP BeneDirect web site and they have accepted and aknowledged payment of my full year's medical coverage . looks like at this time i have a credit for the full year's dollar amount . they'll probably substract each month's medical preminum from that credit amount .
i also pay ahead on my local phone & lite bills and they credit me in the same fashion . so , for any of you interested in doing the same , just send them a check .
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Allan,
Keeping up with the ADP folks could be a full time retirement job...
Yesterday I received two statements from ADP via snail mail....One was a three month statement with the wrong dollar amounts and the other was a two month statement that somewhat agreed with the dollars that I had signed up for on the Annual Enrollment sheet and the confirmation email that I received later..
Sure does behoove one to keep on top of these things and not just drop a check in the mail for every statement that comes along..
BB
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amen boatbum on trying to keep up with the ADP people . between (mis) billings , wrong billings , double billings , and triple billings ; i figured it was easier to just dig down deep into my savings account and write them one single check for the year than to debate with them every single monthly billing period . last thing i want to do is attempt to pay them on line or have them debit my personal accounts for the wrong amounts .
this way , i've got one single cancelled check and a invoice for a annual amount we agree on .
ADP must have hired back the old people that xerox used to do their customer billing in the old days . i actually had a couple of old customers who purposely picked a high volume billing plan that they knew they'd never meet or exceed just so they knew exactly what their copy bill would be every month instead of trying to figure out what was correct or wasn't . honest .
one of the most difficult chores i had to do as a tech was explain a customers bill to them . first xerox would bill for a ten day period . then the next billing cycle would be for 40 days . then the next would be for 20 days . it was never for a consistent 30 day period . it was almost as if xerox only had one computer and they only switched it over to use it for copy billing when they weren't running manpower numbers or MCBSC or parts usage or some other dang report that wasted our time . :blink: .
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hi allen,
i think your prediction has some validity, if i were the cfo of a company i would prefer the "cash balance" and forfiet any liability, the days of a "promised income" are fading fast
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not only does my prediction have validity kilo. :) . but in this circumstance , the trend is my friend cause ' promised pensions ' are gradually going away and cash balance or ' defined contribution ' plans are increasing . even xerox still offers the higher of the three ( actually four ) lump sum calculations right now , BUT will no longer offer it for future retirees and new hires .
which is why this press release caught my eye , cause it gos against the prevailing trend .
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General Motors pension problems ? ?
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/.../100507/1052656[/url]
needless to say , this isn't the opinion of xertech , myself , Normxxx , suite101 , or David Welch or a reflection of General Motors as a corporation or it's officers . this is strictly for educational purposes only . :) .
pension problems usually come home to roost . :blink: . or they end up in PBGC's ( Pension Benefit Guarantee Corporation ) lap .
p.s. for further information on General Motors and their pension plans , please see the archives ( thank you :) xertech ) for my two posts on January 22nd ( one on this page & the other on page 35 ) and my post of december 22nd on page 32 on this forum . keep in mind that because of my policy of deleting some past messages to avoid duplication , that the page numbers may change , but the dates of the posts never change . enjoy .
p.s.s. and what is my opinion and probably the opinion of kilo869 is the way to avoid these questionable pension problems is to take your lump sum , roll it into a rollover I.R.A. account and make your own pension .
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in checking out the ADP BeneDirect web site this morning , they subtracted the first medical preminum amount from the check i wrote them in january for my full year's retiree medical coverage . so it'll be easy to track my remaining balance left in my account durning this year as the year progresses . looks like they're going to go in the first of every month and deduct my next month's premium payment . least i won't have to worry about getting invoiced and making any more payments this year .
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for those of you getting close to age 65 , you might want to go to the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com ) and check out a couple of links under the " contact " tab on the tool bar on the top of your screen . there is listed some 40 odd post - 65 health plans xerox provides on the " Post - 65 Health Care Providers " link and on the " Post - 65 Health Care Providers Summaries " link is the web site for these different plans . talk about attempting to ' honor the promise ' . i can imagine the staff and time necessary to keep all these plans and contracts in place .
in our area , the United Healthcare plan 930 is the one my post - 65 retired friends were offered .
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the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) has a new question of the month . it's regarding Retiree Healthcare Accounts and they give a web site : ( http://www.flexdirect.adp.com[/url] ) . i wasn't successful in setting up a new account there . possibly one of you might be more successful . i'll try again later . stay tuned .
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hi allen
i struck out on that adp website as well
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hi kilo ,
in checking out every single link i could visit on that site without actually registering , i think it's for CURRENT emoloyees and not retirees as the matterofchoice web site lead me to believe .
however , i do believe that xerox will offer it in the future . and it's obvious that ADP can handle it if xerox decides to offer it sometime in the future . i intend to continue to monitor the site regularily to see if they've ' flipped ' us on yet .
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more on the goverment's ideas on how to help labor :
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/fy2006/labor.html[/url]
once again , many issues affect retirees . without throwing a fly in the ointment , i've heard it said that the adminstration has taken on too many issues this term and that may risk that less gets done . but , i am happy to see so many issues benefical to retirees brought to the forefront . possibly more will now be done to assist retirees in not only saving and strengthing their benefits , such as retiree healthcare and pensions , but also increasing them . :) .
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A.R.X.E. reports that their proposal to limit " golden parachutes " will not be brought before the board at xerox's next meeting in 2005 . A.R.X.E. doesn't intend " to go away " . for those with membership , you might want to log in at : ( http://www.arxe.org ) and see what A.R.X.E.'s next step is going to be .
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by the way , to those of you who haven't joined A.R.X.E. yet , you might reconsider in light of the offer from Ford Motors with special pricing on vehicles for xerox current employees AND RETIREES . special instructions , codes , and web sites on A.R.X.E.'s web site on the link on the left tab for " Retiree Discount Programs " . you'd probably more than save your $10 sawbuck .
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hi allen,
i'm turning 62 next month so went down to ssa, i have a menial job now ($25k), their recommendation was cut back ($12k, if possible) and get on the public dole....break even point for me is 80 years old (approx). for you i would say it's a no brainer.
kilo
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appreciate your input kilo . it helps others in their decision making process . and you're right , for me it was a no - brainer cause i had already done my planning . and i have a plan to keep my income below the limits so as to not pay any income taxes on my social security benefits between the ages of 62+ and 65 . after that age ( 65 ) , you can earn as much as you want again and not pay any taxes on your social security income .
and your experience with SSA telling you ' the sooner the better ' matches what everyone i've talked to says too after talking to them .
p.s. by the way , agree with your assessment of why ' Philly ' lost the game . they sure were dragging their feet the last few minutes of the game . that and " carry the damn ball with both arms " guys . even my wife pointed that out ( she asked me . " aren't they supposed to be carrying the ball with both arms " :) ) watching the game . my wife's from Jersey and i met her at the Philadelphia YMCA dances downtown when i was stationed at the Navy Yard there . so we were both rooting for the eagles .
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hi allen,
on the shareholder proposal, do you remember in the 70's they were asking the shareholders to vote for "executive incentives"? by the way, have you read about kilt (ceo of gillette)......take the money and run, don't worry about flushing a good company (whoops...sounds familiar)
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unfortunitely you're right kilo . and it's not just xerox that suffers from executive pay problems . it's a problem with most companies . Carly's gone and Anne will walk too if the share price of xerox doesn't meet expectations in the future . the market can give anyone a couple of years , but after that , if you don't perform , you're history . just like our jobs .
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Kilo.
I'm glad to hear the SSA folks gave you the straight skinny on grabbing it at 62 instead of waiting and working forever...My first check goes in on direct deposit next Wednesday and the third Wednesday of each month thereafter... :D
Maybe you'll have a little free time to get down to your in-laws place in FL after that and we can play golf and indulge in a little adult beverage and toast the "good old days with X"...
My last day as a contract employee is 4/29 and then we are off to Ocala as soon as the escrow on the CA house closes...I gave 4 months notice around the first of January that I would be leaving at the end of April...I figure that was good enough for "them" to find my replacement but so far "they" have done nothing to make it happen...I really feel sorry for my customers but I can't wait around forever...There are too many bass to catch and release and too many golf balls that need my attention... :)
When I signed up with the SSA, I did it on line and it was a snap...The nearest SSA office from here is about 200 miles away and they have a rep who makes the trip up here once a month but he is always booked solid for the whole day...The online thing was really easy...After I submitted it electonically a lady called me to confirm it, answer any questions I might have and to tell me what supporting documents I needed to send to her...After she received the documents she called back and told me all was approved, how much my check would be and what day it would be deposited....It was the easiest thing I have ever done where the Federal Government was involved...I had heard so many horror stories about the foulups that have taken place but I think the online registration has made it a little more error free...
Good luck on your decision and stay in touch,
BB
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thanks for the input boatbum ,
really appreciate your information . makes it easier for others here to decide for themselves what the heck to do when they get that old . afterall , we'll all team mates and friends here . never saw the day when i was up to my ears on a bad machine problem that i didn't really feel good when one of my friends and team mates walked in the door of the account / copy room and threw his coat off and we fixed the machine together . even when we didn't exactly fix it just right , i always had so much fun being confused TOGETHER . :)
my social security ( and the largest social security office for the entire state ) office is just a few blocks from me . and i walk within a block or so of them several times a day on my walking route . after i get my check started , i'll still walk by when i'm in alaska and salute every day . it'll be a few more years yet for me cause i just turned 60 a couple of months ago .
good luck on your florida move . one of only seven ( 7 ) tax free states in the nation . and coming from california , you're going to love it .
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hi allen and boatbum,
i can remember being elbow deep in a 6180 and looking up to see a friend/co-worker walk in the door, it's a great feeling.....as for ssa, signing on-line is a snap, but i heard good reports about the local office (next town over) and i had a few questions so got an appointment, and was treated very well. it's like they want to give the money away.
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100 sheets 20 lb bond paper, locked and loaded
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you'll also find kilo that your local friendly ( ? ? ) I.R.S. office usually has plenty of these available . i always get one every year and reread it for the changes and differences and keep it in my library ( if it's available , you'll find yourself looking it over during the year whenever you have a question about your own personal decisions ) all year til the next year's issue . i usually get a hand full while i'm there and give them out to my friends .
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thoughts on retirement.......and a few other things :
http://www.2000wave.com/article.asp?id=mwo021105[/url]
John Mauldin has issued his own disclaimer so that just leaves mine that this isn't the opinion of myself , or xertech and simply for educational purposes only . just remember whose money it is when you're getting ready to invest it . :) . and how damn hard it was to save it . as they say about how to make a small fortune in the stock market , " start with a LARGE fortune " . been there , done that too .
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General Motors pension , health care costs , and other issues :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/.../100507/1060211[/url]
as you can see , retiree benefit expenses can really cost a company .
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after living in Taxachusetts i've learned that if teachers oppose it, it must be good
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hi kilo ,
won't comment on your description of teachers being " good " . my experience of teachers from having worked on a exclusive ' school district ' team ( worked on pretty much nothing but school copier machines durning that time ) my last 8 years with xerox was that teachers weren't particularily " bright " . :) . but , before i get beat up by any teachers , " anyone that works with youth to try to teach them anything , has my admiration " .
thought you ( and others ) might find this interesting :
http://www.calstrs.com/Investments/Invport.aspx[/url]
also found on the Calstrs web site .
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just came from the ADP web site ( http://www.benedirect.adp.com[/url] ) . these are the people that handle our retiree medical care premium payments . they have deducted my second month's payment from my check i sent them for my year's medical coverage . looks like they're going to subtract every month's payment on the last day of the month . i can see it's important to get that one check correct if you pay one single annual payment as i did , cause otherwise you get down to the last payment for december and you might be short a few clams .
for those of you wanting to set up an account with ADP on their web site , please see my detailed instructions for how to do so on my post of october 26th , 1:35 p.m. on page 24 on our archives ( thank you :) xertech ) on this forum . keep in mind that as i delete past posts with links that are no longer valid as i clean up this forum ( i regularily go through my past messages to make sure the links in the posts are still good - if they aren't , i delete them , thus changing page number counts for the total forum ) , that my page numbers i reference to past posts may change , but my dates of past posts never changes .
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hi allen, tomorrow i waddle down to the public trough and sign up for social security.......i'm gonna get some before it's gone. i've enjoyed the articles you've posted in a perverse way. i just can'[t believe how unprepared some people are or how they were decieved by the companies they worked for.
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hi kilo ,
sorry about being late in getting back to you , but i was gone from my kona condo to do some work on my lots on the hilo side of the big island for a few days . i should remain ' in house ' now at my Kailua - kona condo and going surfing every morning at white sands beach until the 19th of april when i have made reservations to return to hilo again .
your specific comment about people being unprepared for retirement and hood winked by their companies ( or whoever else ) means that my posts are having the desired effect of education . and hopefully prevention of some of those problems that we read about in those articles and links .
and i definitely agree with your getting some of that social security money before the trough runs dry . or at least get your monthly check calculated before they change the formula . and i figure that future formula changes aren't going to be in your favor . and now you're in line for those annual cost of living increases . i figure the CPI numbers are going to go up along with inflation in the future . now , your check at least will get bigger every year now too .
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thanx allen,
looks like i've got some reading over the weekend. on the ssa, iv'e talked to my boss about cutting me to half time so i'll get a greater portion of my ss check. the wife loves her job so she'll probably go to 62 (1 1/2 years) then we'll probably be snowbirds
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kilo ,
the snowbird life style ( alaska in the summer , hawaii in the winter ) really works well for us at this stage of our retirement . later , i probably won't want to endure the added hassle of security checks of flying and will attempt to settle down full time over here in hawaii . but that probably won't be for another 10 years yet .
right now , a smaller condo ( thousand square feet or so ) on either end and a vehicle on each end works o.k. we're not at either residence long enough to feel the lack of space very much . plus condos are really nice to just " close the door and go " type of living .
keep us in touch with your snowbird decisions . there's alot of xeroids right behind ya . especially if this new early out rumor is correct .
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received in my forwarded mail yesterday a Aetna Pharmacy Benefits handout . this is a five ( front & back ) page Aetna Preferred Drug List and explanation of the medications that Aetna covers .
the handout gos into explanations of why some medications require precertification .
i guess because i choose Aetna as my health care provider this last go - round , i get this additional drug coverage in addition to the Caremark drug care coverage xerox already provided me . ? ? since i'm not on any medications now , i'm not going to try to figure out which one i should use .
i'll just wait until the need araises and figure it out at that time . nice having all this coverage . :) .
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hi allen,
i'm presently trying to dig up info on Gilette, which was a great boston company, then Kilt, the SOB, i mean CEO sold out to P&G, made $175million for himself and now the rumor is that retiree benefits will be cut. that is why a get nervous when i hear about a takeover.
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i'll go out later tonite kilo and see what i can dig up on Gillette for ya . their company ticker symbol is : ( G ) . one of the grear dangers that present xerox techs have if xerox sells their service business is that the buyer probabably IS NOT going to take over all the pension obligations . they'd be crazy to do so .
at least from what i can tell , the PBGC hasn't taken over a Gillette plan yet .
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lots of pensions with auto makers :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/.../100507/1070236[/url]
thought the comment that after watching the steel and airlines companies , they figured maybe they better fix the problem instead of waiting for the goverment to do it was excellent . that's one of the reasons i follow the present airline pension situation so closely is cause they are the leading edge in pension problems . as gos the airline pensions and retiree benefits , so will go our own pension and retiree benefits too .
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i just received a personal e - mail from A.R.X.E. ( somebody there is working 24 / 7 for me i think ? :) ? ) that Xerox Corporation has not only accepted their " Severance Proposal " that was submitted to the board of directors , but also their " Options Proposal " that A.R.X.E. did not submit to the board of directors .
the severance proposal has to do with executive severance agreements , sometimes called " Golden Parachutes " and the options proposal has to do with stock options and stock grants that are sometimes of even greater value .
this is a major victory :) for our organization and in going over to the site ( http://www.arxe.org ) as i was instructed to view the details , i saw the details under the " Chairman's Cornor " under the " 3 / 10 / 05 Shareholder Activism Update " tab . there are further corporate meeting scheduled in the future on this and other details concerning retirees . especially the " Flex Retiree Segregation " issue where retiree health care costs are " segregated " from the employee health care costs as a whole and therein driving our costs up because we , as a group , are more costly to cover because we are older than current employees .
members check it out for yourselves . score one for the " good guys " . hopefully , in future talks about our retiree benefits , things will go easier . ? ? stay tuned .
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just received my e - mail notification from A.R.X.E. about my renewal coming up with them . of course I'll be sending them another $10 . best money I ever spent . god knows how much they've already saved me in medical healthcare premimum increases in the past and certainly in the future .
doesn't that mean we won't see any more healthcare increases in the future . NO , and that would be crazy to expect that . and certainly I'm very happy paying less than any of my other retired friends for more choices than they'll ever have . my membership in A.R.X.E. is just a donation to a outfit that is trying to help me in an area that I really appreciate - healthcare . hopefully xerox can / will continue to offer me , and others here , the same benefits .
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just read the message from the chairman, no question about the $10..........i really felt like someone heard me, by the way, do you put any faith in Motley Fool?
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hi kilo ,
yes , it is nice being heard . even if they don't agree with you , or do what you want , or even if they do something later to still p... ya off . it's still nice to feel like you're heard . and i've always been a firm believer , if you're going to be wrong , be wrong AT THE TOP OF YOUR VOICE . :) . that way , i'm sure i'm heard .
as for the Motley Fools , i think they're alright . when the secular bear market started in 2000 , the Motley brothers were forced to print a retraction nationally on their investment method because so many people lost money on their " foolish four " and other investing tips . and i mean people who lost their kids college education money , retirees losing their lump sums , etc . some really serious stuff .
and i don't blame them or anyone else who makes predictions or gives investment tips . it's ALWAYS buyer beware and i find it best to be your own money manager and be prepared to get the heck out if you start losing money . especially in this secular bear market where we are not setting newer highs over time . in the 90's , everything you touched went up and alot of people mistook that for genius ( heck , anyone can pick stocks and make money doing this stuff ) and then the secular bear market started in 2000 and some lost their savings , retirement , college fund , or simply only have $23k left to show for over $98k made in the stock market since january 24th of this year like i did because i LOST $75k the first three weeks in january . and i was totally in mutual funds the whole time . no individual stocks that blow up now regularily every day .
no kilo , i think the Motley Fools are o.k. but i don't trust anyone anymore . even myself sometimes . :) . greed'll get me back in the market at some point in the future . but i'm certainly not in a bragging mood right now . humble is more the word . like they say about walking into the casino , only take as much as you can afford to lose and leave there . cause this market can certainly separate you from your hard earned retirement savings pretty quickly . and it's not as easy getting it back now either . market's tough in here right now .
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amen to a tough market...i'm still ahead so i'm not complaining, sounds like you might enjoy the book "Bringing Down The House".
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kilo ,
i'm ahead too year to date . and actually my best year since i retired was last year and i've had positive returns every year since i started investing in 1972 . BUT this market in here is tough . and like you , i'm not complaining . just pointing it out to those thinking about jumping in here . and if i had not have jumped out on the 4th ( a day before the high set on the 7th ) , i would have been back in the minus ( - $75k ) range again . and it wasn't fun being down there .
i've got some personal friends not so lucky and trying to sweat it back to positive again . feel there might be another uptrend before market takes off for the summer in may . ? ? time will tell .
sent my $10 check out to A.R.X.E. today and noticed their address was Webster , N.Y. not sure if i sent my last check there or not . ? ? .
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hi allen,
you're right, this is not the time to piss and moan or point fingers, but to look at what kind of impact we can have. i have a friend on the cusp (54 1/4, 30+years) who is trying to make the biggest decision of his life, i've encouraged him to get on this site and absorb as much info as he can, the kicker is he has teenage kids, and he is about to go on long term disability.
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you're right kilo . now is not the time to demand anything , point fingers , find blame , or anything . or at least if you do , try to keep it in the context of a positive dialog like A.R.X.E. is doing . here's more on General Motors :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/.../100507/1072375[/url]
what i thought was particularily interesting was the comment in the above article that said , " if you offer people ' gold ' and ' silver ' , they'll go for the ' gold ' every time " and they need to seriously look at the ' silver ' .
appreciate your reference about this site to your friend . and certainly long term disability brings into the decision prrocess something beyond my knowledge . all of us need to periodically look at our priorities all the time . i bet some of those airlines employees wished they could do it all over again and attempt to keep their demands within reason and still have a company to be able to maintain discussion with about their retiree benefits . now , they've crossed the line of " no return " . and just like putting Humpty Dumpty back together again , these pension plans and attendant benefits will never see the light of day again .
stay tuned .
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it's a brave new world out there, i hope that my 3 sons can manage in it,and i hope that my wife and i can watch the sun set at Mallory Sq.
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we recently pasted the ten thousand hit mark this last week on this topic in 16 months since this forum started . that's approx alittle over 20 hits daily . including weekends .
appreciate your support and input . any suggestions or posts are more than welcome . thanks to xertech for allowing us to continue to put forth and discuss ideas dealing with xerox and retiree issues .
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changes in big three auto makers healthcare :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/.../100507/1074151[/url]
looks like the handwriting is on the wall . hopefully the U.A.W. will be smart enough to see that . the airline unions weren't . sometimes the " promise " is more important than the company's life , it's future to current employees , and present and future retirees .
we'll keep track of it here because i feel that the changes that affect the airlines industry ( already mostly bankrupt ) will also effect the auto makers ( headed there ? ? ) and thus , in the end , us as retired xerox employees . so stay tuned .
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i was born in the Brooklyn Naval Ship Yard hospital in Brooklyn , N.Y. my dad's retired Navy . i was raised mostly in the Tidewater area around Norfolk , Portsmouth , and Deep Creek , Virginia and later across the line in Moyock , North - by god - Carolina on the way to the Outer Banks . so i'm well aware of the good things about the Carolina's . and could go back there and be a " red neck - tar heel " again . it's pretty easy and laid back . i think it would be pretty easy to find a little " back water " place on the intercoastal waterway and drift back to the Civil War era again . for those of you familar with the area , you know what i mean .
but i left the right coast after getting out of the Navy and my return from Viet Nam in 1967 and went to Alaska on the left coast and haven't looked back since . except for an occasional trip to Leesburg when i'd rent a car and spend some time back home in the Dismal swamps area of Virginia & North - by god - Carolina and my folks .
so if you get tired of Florida kilo and the problems of that area , just go up the coast a few states and look around . i'd drive as far north til the palm trees quit growing and then drift back south gradually until i found a cheap , warm , laid back bayou type of a town with the Civil War statute in the front lawn of the town square across from the court house . fishings pretty good ( bass , crappie , all salt water ) . hunting is good ( shot my first deer there when i was 11 ) . although they didn't have many when i was a kid there , there are many golf courses now i understand . four seasons . can get get a trace of snow in the winter - usually gone within a day or so , although summers can be muggy . a baseball cap would be the order of the day there . usually with a famers fertilizer emblem on it ( get'em free most anywhere ) .
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i'd like to take this time to personally welcome " noni " as our newest registered member . she is a personal friend of mine . and although isn't technically a xeroid , she is in the process of setting up a web site for their non - profit organization and wanted to get a peak at how someone like Invision Power Board could be of assistence to them . so i signed her up here on xertech and she'll probably lurk awhile and learn .
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just received a series of e - mails from A.R.X.E. the first was thanking me for receipt of my dues check . the second was as regards one of their members sending A.R.X.E. members e - mails offering business services such as the one i posted yestersday from Bill Sobon offering his real estate services in South Carolina . A.R.X.E. is going to take this issue up at a future meeting and i'm going to ignore it for awhile until i hear from xertech or other members of the Admin Team regarding this issue . i figure if it doesn't get out of hand , AND HELPS OUR MEMBERSHIP , then i'll pass it along . ? :) ?
i have since changed my mind and have deleted the link :( to Bill's real estate services web site . those of you serious enough about getting ahold of Bill can " google " your way into him i'm sure .
the third e - mail was from A.R.X.E. informing me that Daimler Chrysler decided to offer retired xerox employees special pricing for Chrysler , Dodge , and Jeep products . so this is another good reason to join A.R.X.E. and send them $10 and get some links for cheaper vehicles . Ford already has a similar program and link on A.R.X.E.
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the squeeze begins at General Motors on healthcare :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/.../100507/1075030[/url]
stay tuned
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the last itme that we drove south to the Sunshine State we laid over in south carolina, almost georgia, in a town called Suntee..........had it all, good restuarants (and of course a waffle house) golf, fresh water fishing, and close enough to the ocean although i don't know if there were any marinas, but the whole place looked very inviting.
south carolina seems to welcome retired northeners, but in north carolina we're still damn yankees, no matter how many red sox bumper stickers we have, and i do like nascar
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sounds like you'd fit right in kilo . and you're right about the further south you go being more welcome . North Carolina ( the tar heel state ) lost more people in the Civil War than any other state . which is unusual cause most of the battles were fought in Virginia .
and , of course , the further south you go , the warmer it gets . which ain't bad either . i understand Georgia can get pretty " red necky " . if you know what i mean ? ? . think it's because of General ( " war is hell " ) Sherman's " march to the sea " . it was pretty rough on the population of that region . the South was held back for probably almost a hundred years . some are still fighting the war there ( " the South will raise again " ) .
don't care much for nascar nor do i chew ' baca , but yeh , i could move back there .
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more on General Motors healthcare :
http://suite101.com/print_message.cfm/inve.../100507/1075462[/url]
i personally think it's too early to completely say that General Motors healthcare is in danger of going away . for one thing , financially , GM has tons of cash and a very viable business . IF they'll run it right .
but , as gos other corporations healthcare programs , both current and for retirees , so could go ours . stay tuned
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Allan,
I have to call you task on your opinion of Georgia as a "rednecky state"...Granted, everyone is entitiled to their own opinion but Georgia is not still living in the Civil War era, or as those of us from the South like to call it, The War of Northern Agression...
Georgia is the most technilogically advanced state south of the Mason-Dixon line...Emory University and Medical school are on the cutting edge of medical advances and turn out some the best doctors and medical researchers in the country. Georgia Tech turns out some of the most sought after engineers in the country, second only to MIT and I'm sure Kilo can attest to that fact..The University of Georgia turns out athletes, like most state universities do but it also turns out some highly educated folks, especially in the area of International Relations and Communications..
Atlanta is one of the most progressive cities in the country...The Atlanta Philharmonic is recognized worldwide as one the top orchestras in the country...Atlanta is the transportation hub of the south...Try flying anywhere in the south and you will find that you have to go through Atlanta to get there...The museums there will rival any that you will find anywhere in this country....The history and culture in the Savannah and Augusta areas is truly Deep South but with no discrimination...
Granted, there are parts of the state that is still living in the past but I think you will find that everywhere, including Alaska and Hawaii....I haven't spent much time in Alaska, only a few refueling stops in Kodiak, but I have spent some time in Hawaill and found that there is quite a bit of bias there toward us non-natives...
Having lived here in CA for the past 28 years I find a lot of discrimination here also...I live very close to an Indian Reservation and find a lot of reverse discrimination here...Sometimes I feel very discriminated against, especially when I go to service machines at their "free medical clinic" and at the "Indian gaming establishment"...
Just wanted to put in my two cents worth in defense of Georgia...
Boatbum
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no problem in your calling me to task . i meant no harm to the state of Georgia . and i even called myself a " red neck - tar heel " in a previous post yesterday . your two cents is accepted boatbum . i guess i should have put in a few smiley faces :) in my post . and you're right about the " bias " towards non - natives ( haole's as we're called or " round eye " ) in hawaii .
and certainly the natives in alaska are also asserting their rights more and more too . my apologies to the great state of Georgia . here's hoping i don't get a ticket driving through there from a law inforcement officer who reads this forum . :) .
and , as i already said , i could move back to the South so i guess i'll have to be more careful if i want to receive the full southern hospitality if i return .
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hi allen and boatbum,
glad i didn't have step in to break that one up. when traveling through georgia, the only problem i could see was tht there were'nt any places to lay over.............I-95 is a long way from Hotlanta. we haved stopped along way for fuel and food with my boston accent and massachusetts plates and always recieved cordial treatment.
i work at an engineering college, and we give georgia tech it's props............by the way, five schools play DivI football do not have the word "university" in their name........you've guessed one.
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Kilo,
I'm gonna' take a shot at the other 4: Army, Navy, Air Force and Boston College... <_<
BB
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no problem between boatbum and i kilo that a few extra words can't fix . if i had just put a few more smily faces :) in my post , boatbum could have more easily understood that i'm an ole southern ( wasn't born , but was certainly raised ) boy myself and really like the lifestyle . heck , i never wore shoes as a kid except to go to school ( required ) or for a couple of months in the winter . usually from April through October i was without anything on my feet .
the only difficulty i'd have with living in North Carolina , South Carolina , or Georgia is their respective state income tax structures . i'd have to really do a indepth study of each state before i could really begin looking seriously at one or the other .
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Allan,
:) I didn't mean to ruffle your feathers with my reply but the south has taken a lot of grief over the years about being illiterate redneck tobacco chewing hicks....I spent most of the first 32 years of my life in the heart of the deep south and I don't chew tobacco, still have most of my original teeth and have a bachelors degree from the University of West Florida....My wife is a native of central Florida and somehow she managed to eek out a Masters in Nursing from Tulane University...After all these years on the left coast it still amazes me to hear native Californians who have never been east of Phoenix expound on the fact of how backward the south is... B)
My Dad's folks were shrimpers on the FL Gulf Coast and some of the most honest hard working people I have ever met...From the time I was about 9 years old I spent every summer at sea working on my grandpa's shrimp boats and I'll tell you right now, that is hard work....None of my uncles had all 10 fingers and one of them lost an eye while working the boats but that was all part of the job and no one complained too loudly...Two of my cousins are still in the shrimping business and they will continue until they go broke, like most of the rest of them have already done...
I still have a lot of relatives in Alabama and Florida and am really looking forward to moving back there where you never have to guess what's on their mind because they are straightforward and open, unlike a lot of the glitz I have met here on the Left Coast...
BB :D
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well said boatbum :D . even though i definitely agree with your opinion about the rest of the nation's idea of the South , it never bothered me cause i really didn't mind being called a red neck tar heel hick cause i really liked the area and life style .
it's just that after Viet Nam , i was ready for a change and Alaska provided it . as for California , i'm sure there are ( here i go again :) ) nice people there , but i wouldn't touch La - La land with a 10 foot pole . too many crazies there ( just watch the television ) . and i went to enough xerox schools on the west coast to be able to form my own opinion . just me , of course .
your family of shrimpers is exactly like the farmers i worked for $5 a day in the fields with field hands ( there were whole families living on $35 to $50 a week ) as a kid . and i wasn't the only red neck hick white kid out there either . so i know where of you speak . and actually it was a very happy childhood there . wouldn't have traded it for anything . i didn't see real ugly discrimination until i went to college in larger towns cause there wasn't any where i grew up .
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You mean the "land of fruit and nuts"???
;) :D B) :P
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like i said , i'm sure there's some nice areas there . but it seems to be too popular and really crowded . and having driven in the traffic , i don't see much easy & laid back about the life style there .
not like parts of Nevada where i drove for hours without seeing very many cars . or Alaska where moose jump out in the road . Eastern Washington & Eastern Oregon seemed to be o.k. too except Oregon has a brutal income tax . as does California .
i guess i like it kind of solitary and open country .
yeh , fruit & nuts sounds about right . better than crazies anyway . :) .
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Northern woods is where I'm headed in a few years...
Alaska is great but a bit far for the children to visit on weekends...
Eastern Washington State a bit too stark and dusty for my liking but we did love the Olympic Penninsula.
I think we will stay within spittin' distance of a Great Lake...
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heard nice things about that area . probably enough woods and wilderness there for me too . abit too much cold and snow for me now . especially after having lived in Alaska with their winters since 1967 . seemed like the winters were getting longer & longer . just started spending most of the winter here in hawaii since i retired and the snow bird schedule of spring / summer / fall in Alaska and winters in Kailua - Kona ( Big Island ) , Hawaii just about right .
will probably attempt to live here full time when i get too old to travel later . figure i can always go back to Alaska later . spent 11 years working Southeast Alaska ( was the sole resident tech in Ketchikan and Sitka and worked on a small team in Juneau ) and they don't have much winter there so may end up there if they get too rough on an old red neck tar heel hick haole here in paradise later . us " round eyes " stick out over here . luckly , there's more and more haole's over here in hawaii as they grow with the retired baby boomers .
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What a great territory...Ketchikan was one of our favorite places when we visited AK a few years back. What a great little town.
I love the story about the tunnel they built...the feds would only fund a bomb shelter...so they made one with a road going through it. Isn't that how the the story goes? :rolleyes:
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you know , in spite of living and working in Ketchikan for 6 years , i never heard that story . and you're right , it was a nice little town . i remember when they got their first traffic light down town . and their first McDonalds .
if I were to spend winters in Alaska , I'd probably start there . Juneau wouldn't be bad either . alittle less rain in Juneau and alittle more town .
Sitka wasn't bad either . more isolated . remember when they got their first traffic light too .
in Southeast Alaska , the further north you go , the less rain you get and the colder and more winter / snow you get . course , that's true for most of Alaska . the further north you go , the colder and more winter you get .
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A.R.X.E. http://www.arxe.org[/url] announces their 2005 annual meeting in Rochester , N.Y. on June 9th . just under half the membership of ARXE resides in upstate New York so it was decided to hold the meeting there for the greatest attendence .
there is a poll on the site for members to vote if they plan on attending . my vote was the second and i voted not to attend . the poll is at 50% - 50% right now with zero for undecided .
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boatbum wins the trvial pursuit prize of the day the three service academies, bc and georgia tech. my middle son (31yrs) is suggesting Marathon, in the Keys for my retirement.............i think that's for his benefit.
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my wife visited the Keys kilo . and Marathon was one of her favorite places on the Keys . and if i were going to look at the " right " coast again and the income tax ( none ) structure of Florida still pulled me in , i would look at the Keys .
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Kilo,
If your son is trying to get you to retire in Marathon you better work a lot harder and make a lot more money or win the lotto or something...I was just reading in my wife's Coastal Living magazine that the median price for a house in Marathon is something over $600k... :o ...Not too many retired xeroids living there I think....I have diving out of Marathon many many times and it is truly beautiful and the diving is great..
Marathon, and the whole chain of Keys, is a fantastic place...Just ask John@GenisisGraphics...He is lucky enough to live down there in the Keys and have his boat tied up at the seawall in his back yard...
I'm glad I won the NCAA trivia quiz...Now show me the money that I won for the correct answer...I think I will use my winnings to make a down payment on a house in Marathon.. :D
Boatbum
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just received a e - mail from A.R.X.E. on the poll on the annual meeting on june 9th in Rochester , N.Y. and the article in the Sarasota Herald - Tribune newspaper . both i 've already reported on here .
get the news first here . :) . stay tuned .
the present poll results are :
38 members NOT going to attemd for 69.09%
10 members planning on attending for 18.18%
and 7 members undecided for 12.73%
will update these poll numbers tonite - my time - rather late you guy's time .
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the xerox 401(k) / hewitt web site http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url] announces a bunch of mutul funds too numerous to mention that are now closed within our 401(k) . check your account to see if any are your funds and for further details .
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we're leaving friday to visit my in-laws, they have a double wide in an over 55 community in englewood (south of Venice), nothing special, but i woudn't mind wintering there, then keeping an eye out for something that may be more appealing...........within my budget. of course
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one of the most pleasurable things about real estate for me kilo was always just the driving around and looking at the stuff . doesn't cost you anything and you run across some nice little towns and subdivisions that are kind of out of the way of the normal traffic hussle and bussle . Key Colony Beach off the main hyway on the Keys alittle north and east of Marathon was just such a place - a few miles off the main drag on the Atlantic side of the Keys ( I'd prefer the Gulf side of the Keys , but you have to go where there's space and quiet on the Keys ) . and it looked nice . the Gulf ( west ) side of Big Pine Key looked nice too .
on the Keys , i was always trying to get as far from the main drag as possible for some peace and quiet from Hyway 1 . and the fact that you're willing to look at single and double wides will certainly help on your budget .
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Xerox's credit & debt ratings :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/.../100507/1077076[/url]
article mainly focuses on General Motors and other companies debt & credit ratings , BUT Xerox is mentioned more than once and I thought you'd like to see how the financial investment market views what Xerox is doing lately .
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questionable 401(k) practices :
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7319239[/url]
the xerox 401(k) doesn't appear to be like this . at least as far as my personal experience . and the nice thing about being retired and separated from the company is that you can roll over your 401(k) to a self directed roll over I.R.A. account with someone else at any time in the future .
and you don't even have to discuss it with your old 401(k) custodian if you don't want to . just give your 401(k) account number to your new intended custodian along with instructions / directions on what type of account and where you want it to go and they'll do the rest for ya .
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There are almost $2 trillion in 401(k) plans," says Ann Combs, assistant secretary of the Labor Department's Employee Benefits Security Administration. "There is some element of society that is going to see that money and they're willing to take advantage of it."
That one statement says it all. it used to be that a fool and his money are soon parted, but you don't have to be much of a fool any more.
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not to belabor the civil war (war of southern succesion) but it appears that after marching to the sea sherman headed north to punish the carolinas.....the southern troops surrendered two weeks after appomatox............ he was right about one thing, war is hell
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there are no belabored issues between friends or on this forum / topic .
and you're right about money soon parted from a fool . and it is getting less difficult to separate money from people : there's so many different investment strategies now . as Peter Lynch , past manager of the Fidelity Magellan fund , once said , " if you can't explain it to a kid or write it on the back of a envelope , stay away from it " .
you also have your history right kilo . although Sherman did have more difficult due to the swamps and terrain moving up the coast of the Carolinas then he had on his march through Georgia to the sea . General Sherman was one of Grant's favorite generals .
President Lincoln was once told that General Grant drank wiskey and Lincoln's reply was to get his other generals some of the same wiskey .
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hi allen andd boat bum,
looks like i'm heading to englewood, fl to check on the in-laws, i probably won't get to look around much, hell, i'll be happy if i can get in a sunset..............i'll have internet access so don't go talking about this old yankee, after being a red sox fan for 62 yrs, i still can't get used to being called a yankee, so we'll just go with xeroid.
well at least i can look at the real estate guides
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have a nice trip kilo . drive safe . here's another real estate article that mentions Florida real estate :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/23658/1077956[/url]
let us know what you find on your trip and your impressions after you're down there .
and i don't mind being called most anything . just don't call me late for dinner . :) .
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hi allen, thanks for the link and all the others that you give us, if i don't read them right away i print them out and take them to bed with me, if you check the investment idea page goombay is just begging for allen coleman's finance 101............i live in boston area and state street is about as sound as you can get......i'll hope to report back to you what i find in florida
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thanks buddy . i'm usually doing the research for myself anyway to keep up with issues affecting us ( i'm one too :) ) as retirees . and looking for investment articles for myself to further my understanding of those issues too . i look fotward to your Florida report ( as do others here i'm sure ) upon your return . Florida is a nice tropical alternative to the frozen northern parts of America . and it's a tax free state to boot .
i'll get to goombay's reply now
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A.R.X.E. http://www.arxe.org[/url] announces that Xerox is sending cancellation notices to " a small number of Flex retirees " regarding " non - payment of their invoices " for their healthcare coverage . " some of the retirees have not paid since last year " .
A.R.X.E. mentions that retirees should keep up to date on their invoices .
in my own personal situation , it makes my choice of paying ahead look better and better .
don't wait for the ' notice ' that you might miss in the mail . go on the ADP web site ( http://www.benedirect.adp.com[/url] ) and check your balance and think about paying ahead or at least have it automaticly taken out of your bank account or credit card . otherwise you're going to be under the gun every month .
there are complete instructions on my post of October 26th at 1:35p.m. on page 24 in our archives ( thank you :) xertech ) on how to set up and check your account on their site . keep in mind , that due to my deleting past posts with nonvalid links , the page number might not be the same , but the date of the post is always the same .
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just received a personal e - mail exchange between A.R.X.E. and one of their members :
" The Association of Retired Xerox Employees FYI "
" Any of you may not have been receiving invoices for your monthly medical premiums, especially those who turned 65 in 2004 , need to check with Xerox health benefits office ASAP . "
" I personally did not receive invoices for half of 2004 until Jan 05 "
A.R.X.E. then went into detail with this member about the importance of keeping up with the status of your healthcare billing . PLEASE reread my post of April 6th at 6:19a.m. on our archives ( thank you :) xertech ) if you have any questions regarding this urgent matter .
my personal advice is , " if you supposed to get a bill , or think you might supposed to be billed , DO NOT wait . " it may be difficult getting reinstated once you're been terminated from a plan .
word to the wise should be enough . if in doult ( as to weither you owe a payment or not ) , check it out . it's your benefit to lose at this point .
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$ 3.1 Billion in health care costs in 2004 for 550,000 U.S. employees , retirees , and dependents :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/86836/1081982[/url]
lot of money . and , of course , those costs aren't ever going to drop anytime soon . matter of fact , they are probably going to raise at an ever increasing rate . especially if you're going to offer any kind of a low premium to your employees and retirees .
we can add Ford Motors to the list of companies to watch what happens to their retiree health care to get some idea of what could happen to OUR retiree health care . suggest those that are concerned about " the promise " , get over it and get used to being happy with whatever coverage we are offered . and if the price is too high , just look at the open health care market and if you can get it cheaper or better , then do it .
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just got a e - mail from Eric - Brown on a tech that's having an intermittent ( the best kind :) of problem ) P06-251 on a Docutech NP - 135 . and heck , i wasn't much good on high volume even when i had two of them . but , i know there's enough of ya that haunt my forum that can assist Eric and his tech . so just respond here or go over to the Docutech forum and respond . hey , KT , help this guy out . you're pretty current on this stuff .
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sounds like eric's got a laser problem,
anyhoo i'm back from the sunshine state, spent most of the week fixing things at the in-laws place. almost stepped on an alligator, watched the sunset on the gulf and got tongue kissed by a cocktail waitress...but i digress.
the old saying "location, location, location" really applies, the hurricanes didn't scare too many people away,
a double-wide in a nice community will go $150k+, a slab house in a gated community will be double. i'm beginning to think that a two month rental in a beach front condo might be the way to go. there are so many options there that i would not do anything permanent without a long stay.........and yes, there are a lot of people flipping property there.
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hi kilo ,
appreciate your answering Eric's e - mail message . it was for another tech i think . they'll hammer it out on the other forums i'm sure . just wanted to assist if i could .
real estate pretty much everywhere is full of speculation now . especially the Florida region . see this link :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/23658/1081705[/url]
the prices you mention sound pretty good to me and if i were interested in the " right coast " , i'd go down there with my check book .
i've been through several " boom - bust " cycles in Alaska & Hawaii and usually come out ahead cause i never buy with an eye on " how much i'm going to make off this buy " , but instead ask myself if this property - condo - double wide - etc will work in my personal living situation . and if i can't really see myself using it that much or going back there that much to justify the expense , i just don't do it .
on my many travels through America , i've seen alot of really beautiful and pretty property that i thought was really cheap and worth the money . and i had the cash available . but , i passed up on them cause i couldn't see myself living there .
i spend HALF the year in Hawaii and really make use of my condo and vehicle here . and i spend the other HALF of the year in Alaska and really use my condo and vehicle up there . and if i were setting up the same thing on the " right coast " , i'd just have one vehicle and drive from the north down to Florida and spend as much time as necessary until i got tired of the driving and then i'd choose which location i wanted to stay . in my case , later , it'll be Hawaii .
i could change my mind . i could wind up staying in Alaska . in that case . i'd probably pick some little town in Southeast Alaska like Ketchikan where they have very little winter . or i may develop a health problem that requires me to live closer to a large medical center like in Honolulu or the west coast . ? ?
for now though , with my health , and me surfing every day here on the big island in Kaliua - Kona , i'll probably choose to stay here full time after i get tired of the flying back and forth .
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for those of you who are members of A.R.X.E. , you might log on to their web site http://www.arxe.org[/url] and read the series of articles they have posted on xerox similar to the one i have given a link to above . too many to detail here . check it out .
the poll on the June 9th A.R.X.E. annual meeting in Rochester this year is now :
87 or 31.99% plan to attend
150 or 55.15% do not plan to attend
35 or 12.87% are undecided about attending A.R.X.E. 's annual meeting .
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received a letter today in my forwarded mail dated March 31 addressed to : " Dear ESOP Participant "
it was my last dividend check . this finishes our dividends on our old ESOP shares . i'll be receiving a Form 1099 - DIV next year ( january ) for this year's 2005 taxes .
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just got my reminder for A.R.X.E. dues, you know i'm payin' that right away! best $10 i ever invested
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you bet- cha kilo .
sorry for the delay in getting back to you but i was over on the Hilo side of the Big Island most of the week clearing jungle on my property over there .
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even taking over the pension plans may not solve future problems for United Airlines :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/.../100507/1086955[/url]
it's amazing . i really don't see how United Airlines is going to attract customers and stay in business if this foolishness presists .
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sad :( , but very true kilo .
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new retirement legislation :
http://www.roth401k.com/cardinewsrelease.htm[/url]
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Hi Allen,
this story sounds familiar, luckily i didn't lose my shirt, just a couple of sleeves
FORMER EMPLOYEE SUES XEROX, ALLEGES COMPANY MISLED WORKERS
The Associated Press
MORNING BRIEFING
In a lawsuit filed against Xerox Corp., a former employee alleges that the company misled workers about the soundness of its stock, causing them to lose millions of dollars in their retirement plans.
The suit, filed Monday at U.S. District Court in Hartford, Conn., came days after the copier-and-printer company announced that it would restate billions of dollars in revenue from 1997 to 2001. Xerox used improper accounting techniques to speed the recognition of equipment revenue.
The lawsuit was filed by Keller Rohrback LLP and Susman & Watkins in Seattle on behalf of Thomas Patti, a former Xerox employee. It seeks class-action status to represent more than 50,000 participants in the company's retirement plan.
Bill McKee, a Xerox spokesman, said that company officials had not seen the suit and that they could not comment. The company will defend its actions in court, he said.
Xerox stock represents a substantial portion of Patti's savings in the retirement plan, according to the suit. The value of his stock dropped from about $60 per share in 1999 to less than $7 per share last week, the suit says.
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sorry about being late getting back to ya , but i was at the beach for my last trip this spring before returning to alaska this friday evening .
your news story is so true . don't expect this lawsuit to go very far . no one held a gun to this person's head and told her to buy xerox stock . this is called " specific stock risk " in the investing world . as a general rule . it's suggested that one have no more than 5% of your total portfolio in ANY specific stock issue . and it's also strongly suggested that you not go above 10% even if you work for the company .
in my case i never put any of my 401(k) in xerox stock . figured my ESOP shares were enough . and since i never paid anything for those shares , i figured they were a gift . my cost basis that i've already paid federal taxes on is $13.04 a share . and the stock closed tonite at $13.29 a share . so i figure i'm money ahead so far .
numerous friends and team mates really put alot of their personal and 401(k) funds into xerox stock and most really suffered from it .
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IBM cutting jobs :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/12457/1090966[/url]
stock hasn't been doing well lately either for those employees TOO heavy in their own stock . usually it's a double wammy when you get fired AND your 401(k) gos to heck too .
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well, i stopped by the old district training center this morning and found a couple of old buds. just about everyone left that i knew took the most recent package, but , gues what, they were training a couple of "partners"..................are they ever going to get this PSR thing to work?
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Kilo,
I guess they were overwhelmed by the number of people who wanted to take the package...Out here on the left coast, my old district was just swamped with applications from folks who wanted it..
They drew the line at 31 years tenure..Anyone with less time than that wasn't even considered...The people who run the service agency that paid all of us who had retired and kept working says that they are going completely out of the agent business and will be handling only "temporary partners"...That means they will be sending these folks out to help when the call bubble gets so large that the few remaining CSE's can't handle it...
I can see the handwriting on the wall with that approach..It won't be long before the one's that are left will get disgusted and leave also...I know two people who were so disgusted when they didn't get the package that they resigned anyhow...
Damn, retirement is good... :)
BTW, escrow closes on our CA house on the 19th and then we are off to Florida...Had a massive moving sale last weekend and sold almost everything we own so we will be moving via a Penske rental truck, trailering one of our cars and our youngest son driving the other...Have sold off all excess vehicles and our sailboat and will be giving my trusty Toyota p/u to our oldest son when we leave next week..
Will let you know when we get settled so you can stop in on your next trip to FL..
Boatbum
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kilo & boatbum ,
visited my office yesterday and heard xerox had over 1,500 people who wanted out and only enough money to buy out 500 . tenure cut off in my district was 33 years . below that and too bad - you 're on a waiting list . above that and you qualified .
and you're right , retirement is good . damn good .
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hi allen,
no problem in my district, even had some irif's, guess they were right about us being overstaffed.
there's only a couple of people over55 left now. the odd thing is , why are they training "partners"? it all comes down to benefits which is why i joined X in the first place.
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hi kilo ,
actually alaska , hawaii , and guam were exempt from the early out package due to manpower levels and the difficulty in getting qualified network certified people to transfer there . i was speaking to the seattle / west coast district that we are presently under now .
as for benefits , i actually took a pay cut in my prior job to go to work for xerox because of their benefit and training package available to me at that time ( 1972 ) . in the beginning , i actually got a pay raise every six months . that and the excellent profit sharing ( over 10% and at 15% , the max , for year after year after year ) . course , as you've correctly stated , that's all history now .
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on a personal note , now that i'm back in my home office and have had the opportunity to talk to several retirees , there is a definite mis - communication between xerox / hewitt and the various healthcare providers . in most instances , one will say you are coverd and the other will have no record of that coverage . in almost all instances it's a " key stroke " error that's easily fixed later after several phones calls . BUT in some cases , the retiree has had to pay in cash for his medical care until the problem is resolved . and , of course , the time to find this all out is BEFORE you come through the door on a gurney . :) .
the obvious answer is to verify coverage through matterofchoice.com for yourself , spouse , and dependents AND also set up an account with your healthcare provider on their web site to confirm coverage .
AND , of course , while you're on all these sites , MAKE copies of the verification / confirmation of coverage to use later if a problem develops later durning the year .
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well N-Star (electric utility) workers went on strike and the first thing the company did was suspend medical coverage, they say this is commonplace ,and i'm assumming the union picks up coverage, but it just gives you an idea where priorities are
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it probably is comman place kilo . there are NO federal laws that say a company HAS to offer a medical benefit . and if i were a company and i had employees who struck my company and were trying to put me out of business , i dang sure wouldn't pay their medical care coverage out of my own pocket any more than i'd pay them a paycheck for walking the picket line . if the company suspended medical coverage , then i doult very much that the Union has the money to step in and replace it .
from personal experience , my wife's Laborer's union medical coverage is much more expensive than getting it through Xerox . and i have a xeroid friend whose husband recently retired from a local Teamster's union and had NO retiree healthcare offered . so they are paying full price on the retail market .
from what i've seen , unions aren't the guarantee that some say they are . sometimes unions can screw you just as bad as a company can . just my opinion of course .
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my father was a teamster, he got good medical coverage, but that was before medical costds went through the roof. what i remember most was everytime their contract came up there would be a very long strike, and everytime he built up vacation time the company would sell out and he'd start all over again.
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sorry about the delay in getting back to you kilo , but i was out of town on real estate business for a week .
well aware of the perils of union life . my wife is a retired Laborer's union worker . she's walked her share of picket lines . and her pension was so excellent that instead of taking the lump sum as i always advice , we took the monthly payout . it's roughly a 12% payout . if i could have , i would have given her union my xerox lump sum for the same monthly check .
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under funded pensions will be more in the news in the future :
http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0516/p03s01-usec.html[/url]
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xerox has issued a 2004 claims submission deadline of June 30 , 2005 for
Medical
Dental
Vision
Health Planning Account
Health Care & Dependent Care Salary Redirection Account
for more details go to the xerox / hewitt web site : http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url]
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received in my snail this morning from xerox my 2004 Investment Funds Annual Report ( xerox 401k savings plans ) . this is a report on last year's performance in xerox's tier one - two - and three ( marketplace window ) funds in their 401(K) .
couple of things struck my eye : " Xerox has retained General Motors Asset Management to provide investment services for the plan , ............"
and i was watching the Enhanced Bond fund ( high yield - junk ) through last year thinking i wanted to get a part of their annual performance when i noticed that the Income fund already has 14% stake in High Yield ( junk ) , so that's enough " junk " for me for now .
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My husband is with GM and is supposed to retire in late 2006. We are definitely watching this closely. His particular plant is working heavy overtime still.
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Formertech ,
i'm sure you are following the General Motors news . as this pension problem get bigger , we are either directly affected or know someone who is . keep in mind that if your husband decides to take the pension in lieu of a lumpsum AND General Motors gos the same route later ( bankrupt ) as United Airlines , your husband probably will not :( receive the full pension promised him under the General Motors plan from PBGC if they take over the General Motors plan .
please read the archives ( thank you :) xertech ) from my past posts and go on the PBGC web site ( http://www.pbgc.gov[/url] ) and familarize yourself with their maximum payout calculations . if you have difficulty , let me know and i can give you a couple of links on their site that explain it fully . i'm purposely NOT giving you those links now cause i feel a through visit on their ( PBGC ) site will open your eyes as to our national pension problems . something your husband will need to know when he listens to discussions between the company and his union about THEIR ( keep in mind this isn't a General Motors problems or a Union problem - it's a cultural problem where we've assumed " promises " for some retirees that are impossible ) future .
i can't give you specific investment advice , but the other thing i would do is take a close look at how much GM stock you have in your retirement accounts . most people have entirely TOO much company stock in their retirement accounts . the general rule is to have NO more than 5% in ANY one stock issue in your investment accounts . and to only have NO more than 10% to 15% if you work for the company . and when people are laid off or fired and have too much company stock , it's a double / triple wammy : no job - no pension - and their company stock that they have too much of is almost worthless . :( . and , of course , retiree benefits such as health care coverage is NOT covered by any federal program for any company in bankrupcy .
good luck with your husband's , and your future , retirement . the fact that your husband's " particular plant ....working heavy overtime still " probably won't save the company from their overall problems . it's like the pilot that flew a full plane for United Airlines - his pension & retiree benefits such as healthcare are toast anyway . the best outcome for you , and others , is that General Motors can return to profitability and can continue to pay for their employee and retiree benefits . i'll continue to report here on this and other pension / retirement issues important to us as retirees .
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Xerox's matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) now has a link to a " comment " section where you can leave messages . they state this link isn't for questions , BUT for ideas for future additions or enhancements .
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GM Union workers retirees have no choice of a lump sum over the pension. It's pension or nothing. They own nothing of their pension until they have reached the minimum of 30 years. It's the way the UAW has worked. I think the laws of profits should have made it clear that the pension obligations should have been paid for every year along the way. As you have said...Xerox's pension is fully funded.
Stocks and other funds are of course personally owned as with any other company.
I figure we'll both be working other jobs after the official retirement anyway. I just want him out of the dangerous plant where they have him working 14 hours a day. Whatever we can manage out of the pension we'll deal with.
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Formertech ,
it's refreshing to see someone left who still actually thinks that a company should have kept their pension plans fully paid up as they went along . :) . but , there actually isn't any laws - other than moral - that require that to happen . xerox on their own decided to fully fund their pension plan and actually made a pretty big payment this year . so , at least , that's one thing in xerox management's favor .
union pension rules are entirely different than 401(k)'s and actually date from the 20's and 30's . my wife is a Laborer's Union retiree and her pension is quite good . mainly because of all the laborers who didn't get all the rules and tenure necessary to satisify all the regulations in order to get a pension . and , of course , all their pension money ( usually $3 to $5 bucks an hour for all hours worked ) paid in for all those years gos to sweeten the pensions of those who did qualify . and her pension plan is quite healthy . course they've stopped all the early outs that allowed my wife to retire at age 50 and get raises every year and their retiree medical care is very expensive . so much so that it's cheaper to go on the open market and get your own health coverage . so she's covered under my xerox retiree coverage .
you are wise to get your husband to retire early . studies have shown that those who put off retirement to get a few extra years tenure or a few extra dollars die shortly after they retire . and those who leave early and invest and budget wisely , live longer . i find it's easier to get along with less than it is to try to earn more . your best security is your ability to do without . just me though .
General Motors , WITH THE HELP OF THE UNION , can survive and do so quite well . they do still have half the automoble business in the world . toyota does very well and has an excellent business model . IF the union decides to fight every move the company trys to make to stay in business , then BOTH parties - just as in United Airlines - will lose .
good luck . let us know how you do or let me know if there is anything else i can do to assist you . stay tuned cause i've got a feeling that General Motors will be in the news and i will cover their treatment of retiree issues here on this forum . cause , god forbid , it could happen to us as xerox retirees . and being prepared is half the battle i think .
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first the airlines, then the automakers, next the local governments?
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boy kilo , you really are well informed . ! ! . the next bubble to pop in the pension issue is for states and municipalities and school districts . i haven't brothered to add them to my list to report on cause i'd have a full time job trying to keep up . it's been enough to keep up with corporate pensions . :) .
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received in my snail mail today my may issue of " Benefit News for Xerox Retirees " . excellent reference for those for post - 65 health care questions . there was also an offer for " Sales Agency Owner Opportunities for Xerox Retirees and Referrals "
this issue is available for viewing , and printing out on your printer , on line at : http://www.arxe.org[/url] and http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url]
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hi allen,
thanks for providing some interesting reads............are you thinking of being a sales agent?????????? you know, if i had a chance to do it when i first took my retirement i might have considered it (how hard could it be?)
summer finally hit new england so my outlook has improved and when i read about the airlines i don't feel so bad about the allaire debacle.
speaking of the automakers, when i was a new hire i asked why detroit was in a higher pay grade than boston, and was told because the cost of labor was very high when competing with the automakers, but i'm glad to see the unions willing to co operate.
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hi kilo ,
some of this information just floods in and then other times it dries up . feast or famine i guess , just like service calls used to be . :) . there were times i used to be bored , but after a slew of calls and callbacks would roll in , i'd be looking for boredom again .
not really thinking about being a sales agent , just thought it was interesting that xerox is putting this job " on the street " . i'm going to show this to our sales manager in our local office and get her viewpoint .
after studing fundamentals in different corporate securities for years when i used to trade individual stocks , there's nothing different that Paul did that wasn't done by other companies . and , of course , other companies have had their stocks cut down to size too since this secular bear market began in 2000 . doesn't make it right , just doesn't make it any different .
i agree with your feeling about unions that attempt to sit down and work issues out with the company . doesn't do anyone any good to put the company out of business .
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recently kilo asked me a question on " public " pensions . this article sheds more light on that issue along with our corporate pension problems :
http://www.2000wave.com/pdf/mwo061705.pdf[/url]
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if it were'nt for all the ink about the airlines and GM do you think public pensions would get any press at all?
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hi kilo ,
i do think the numbers are big enough that it would get some press . i know two things for sure :
one - i'm sure glad i've got my lumpsum to manage my own pension .
two - sure am tired of informing all you guys of all the bad news on pensions / benefits / and bad retirement press releases .
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hi allen,
definetly agree about the lump sum, but i do appreciate the posts regarding the retirement woes........i have three sons in their early 30's and am trying to pass along the wisdom o f my years (so they may one day support me). i was interested in your info on roth ira's and plan to do some beach reading in the matter of usin roth ira's to adjust my income bracket
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hi buddy ,
everything you ever wanted to know about ROTH IRAs is at : http://www.rothira.com[/url] and you can check the IRS publication 590 - the retiree's bible .
i've been involved in roth conversions ( this is where you " convert " traditional taxable IRAs into taxfree ROTHs ) ever since they'd been allowed . at the present time i have probably one third of my deferred accounts ( traditional IRAs ) in ROTHs and expect to have most of the rest by age 70 1/2 . at that point , ALL my retirement distributions will be TAXFREE . you have to pay the taxes at conversion , but if you follow the rules , everything coming out later is tax free - plus ROTHs are not subject to required minimum distributions at age 70 1/2 - plus ROTHs transfer more easily to heirs than traditional IRAs do . keep in mind that most studies show that taxes on ROTH conversions are best paid with " personal " dollars . in other words , money OUTSIDE your deferred accounts and NOT money INSIDE your deferred or IRA account .
ROTH conversions are so good , i expect the government to " outlaw " them at some point in the future when us rich retirees with nothing but ROTHs left in their retirement accounts and don't pay ANY taxes . :) . period - state & fed .
your childrens' " first " dollars invested should be in ROTHs . after that they can look at IRAs and 401(k)s and other investments such as real estate . plus , if your kids work for a company with a 401(k) , they need to follow and keep up with the new ROTH 401(k)'s that are supposed to start next year ( 2006 ) at : <a href='http://www.roth401k.com' target='_blank'>http://www.roth401k.com[/url]
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Association of Retired Xerox Employees has some data from their 2005 members meeting on their web site : http://www.arxe.org[/url]
the financials look good for our organization . :) . looking forward to reading the minutes of this meeting if they put it out . 75 members attended and there's some photos so those of ya that are members should log on and check it out .
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hi allen,
still enjoy reading your contributions, sadly i missed the boat on Roth IRAs (did send the articles to my sons).
i still haven't had to touch my lump sum other than re invest it, so now i'm doing my homework on how to make the Roth work for me. if i get the program, what i should do when i start withdrawing is to calculate living expenses plus max Roth contribution for the year. if i'm right so far how do you time your withdrawal and re-investment.
thanx for all the info so far, and dont forget to wax your stick.
kilo on-the-east coast
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hi kilo ,
i haven't had to withdraw any of my deferred accounts yet either . i've been lucky enough to maintain my personal real estate sales to cover my living expenses so far .
i maintain a separate living expenses account and keep it in a tax free money market account with checking . by doing that i relieve myself from having to " time " my withdrawals . by doing it that way , i can write myself a check anytime i want without worrying about weither that will affect my earnings in a " up " or a " down " market . i keep several years worth of living expenses in that account .
i " time " my ROTH conversions by doing them in the fall of every year , usually september / october time frame . this allows the better part of the calendar year to progress before i calculate what my final year's end income will be . if i've sold property , i start with that number for my income and add the amount of ROTH conversion i want to do . i 've picked the 25% tax bracket for myself and did a $115k conversion for last year ( 2004 ) . this calendar year ( 2005 ) i sold property in feburuary so i'll have to allow for that capital gain as a beginning for my total income this year . so i may only do a $105k to $110k ROTH conversion for this fall .
as a general guide for withdrawals , most experts use 4% to 6% to allow one to have enough money til the end so that you don't " outlast " your money . but , of course , that depends on your performance in your investments for the year too . my performance year to date is over 2% in my invested portfolio in spite of most market indices being underwater year to date and over 3% in my total portfolio year to date which also accounts for my remaining real estate values using a conservative tax assessed number and also using my living expenses too . i don't tend to " budget " anymore , but notice that my annual withdrawals are less than 4% .
a good exercise is to run a " required minumin " withdrawal as if you were 70 1/2 right now . that calculation is available in the IRS publication 590 . and your deferred account custodian will be making it for you at age 70 1/2 and telling you at that time how much you will have to take that next calendar year or be subject to a 50% ( ouch ) penality . then you need to project forward , using the " rule of 72 " for possible " doubles " between now and then and calculate if that number is more than you want to take out at that time . if it's more than you want to withdraw or need , then a ROTH conversion MAY be for you . if the required minimum distribution doesn't upset you , then don't worry about taxfree ROTHS at this time .
as you can see by reading the above , retirement planning is complicated and very personal . which is why it's difficult to give " specific " advice to anyone . at least for me . it's really a personal decision .
for me , if i didn't deal with my " ever doubling " ( my adverage investment double is about six and a half years or less - pulled a double in as little as three years once - going back to 1991 ) deferred accounts with ROTH conversions NOW , i'd be in the highest tax bracket ( + 35% ) FOREVER later beyond age 70 1/2 . so i'm paying in the 25% bracket now to keep from paying in the + 35% bracket later . and my " effective " tax is actually 14% to 16% - effective tax is on every dollar earned and your " marginal " tax bracket is on your last dollar earned . the " first " dollar you earn costs you zero percent cause of deductions and the " last " dollar you earn is the most expensive , especially in the larger amounts .
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hi allen,
thanks for the primer, i notice that you are keeping your withdrawals under 4%, do you remember in the 90s when we were advised that we could depend on 10% growth but only withdraw 8% to be safe.
when my oldest boy graduated from college he had credit cards up the wazoo so i had to teach him the rule of 72, he listened and my other two sons seemed to have paid attention.
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kilo ,
i'm not keeping my withdrawals under 4% because i wanted my critical mass to last my life time . i decided my withdrawals based on my specific needs and it just happened to come out at less than 4% a year . which of course made me happy when it just happened to agree with the current conservative thinking on distributions . i decided in retirement that i was going to spend my critical mass ( assets ) and focus on my health and not budget and save as i did all my working career . and i am also very forunate ( lucky ) in my past investment decisions and being a saver all my life and living under my means and having much more money at this point in my life than i can spend intelligently .
i can remember in the past when investment advisors were telling people that they could expect to take out 6% to 8% a year and have it last their life time . i've even seen suggestions of 10% to 11% .
course , with the start of the secular bear market in 2000 with losses of over 50% in most of the indices over the next several years , has changed that thinking . " buy & hold " worked in the 90's . it doesn't work now . at least not with MY money .
long term investors need to think " doubles " . even you and I have several doubles left . your kids will have many - too many to count right now . and , of course , that last double is the best one .
most people are either a " grasshopper " or a " ant " . they are either " savers " or " spenders " . they either have enough set aside for the winter of their lives or they don't . and there's not much you can do to change that fact . you can try and provide a role model . but it's usually each person's decision how to play the cards they're dealt in life . the difference really shows up later in life .
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hi allen,
we're heading off for a week on cape cod so i only quickly scanned the article on retirement for life, it sounds like somebody would like to make money for themselves using my money
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you're correct about " salespeople " selling annuities making lots of money from people who aren't knowledgeable . i think in certain circumstances when it comes to protecting assets from other people trying to attach your lump sum or critical mass , annuities are probably o.k. BUT only then from certain vendors such as Vanguard with ZERO penalities for getting out later and very low expenses along the way . AND only then with a certain part of your asset base . AND especially if you have heirs ( kids ) . you CANNOT give an annuity to your kids after your death . annunities usually stop with the purchasers death . and with new federal guidelines for giving away your estate TAX FREE , up to and beyond a million dollars , it doesn't make any sense at all to give a lump sum away to a insurance company and HOPE you'll get it back in your life time .
enjoy your trip . drive safe . don't forget your bathing suit and surf board .
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for those of ya older than 55 and not 59 1/2 yet , i spoke with a retired xeriod friend of mine yesterday and xerox / hewitt is letting him take a monthly withdrawal from his xerox 401(k) and not take out for taxes or penalities . the rules are that the balance left in the 401(k) has to last longer than 10 years .
i believe this is what the IRS calls " annuitization " and is compariable to " 72t " rules in taking money from an IRA sooner than 59 1/2 and not paying a penality . in both instances you have to pay normal federal plus state , if applicable , income taxes on your withdrawals .
please check with xerox / hewitt to make sure your personal circumstances are the same before you request a withdrawal from your 401(k) . by not rolling your money into an IRA and leaving your money in our 401(k) , looks like you've really got lots of options . plus i understand you can change your mind at any time and still roll your money over later if you want .
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excellent source for checking " old " pension plans :
http://search.csmonitor.com/2005/0725/p13s01-wmgn.htm[/url]
if you've worked for xerox , it's easy to check to see what you may have left , HOWEVER , if you've worked for other companies who have either gone out of business OR changed hands OR merged with other companies , it isn't so easy . so if any of ya have worked for other people in the past and wondered where your money went / is , this article has several excellent links on it . enjoy .
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in reading xerox's second quarter earnings report , xerox " contributed $230 million to it's primary U.S. pension plan " and closed the quarter with 2.1 billion in cash . debt down 2.1 billion year over year and down 1.5 billion from the first quarter of this year .
so it's at least putting some of it's earnings into funding their pension plan and paying down debt .
since xerox is " self insured " on their medical health care and they just cut off their claims for calendar year 2004 on june 31st of this year , xerox should have an idea shortly on their total expenses for 2004 and begin to put together a package to present to us for their open enrollment period for the 2006 health care coverage for current employees and retirees . hopefully we should hear from A.R.X.E. shortly on what xerox is thinking for next year .
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i think that if i could be replaced as easy as these mechanics and flight attendents i think that i would be carefull about making demands (have they forgotten PATCO)
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hi allen,
i had a premonition that in the future all aircraft maintenance will be third party. if we could round up enough retired tech reps we could be on the cutting edge...................
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kilo ,
definitely agree that " third party " maintaince is the way it's going . and not just with aircraft maintaince . as far as how many " cutting edge " techs are still left :) , that's another question altogether .
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just received an email from A.R.X.E. ( association of retired xerox employees ) on the results from their latest Advisory Committe / Xerox Meeting on 7/26/2005 with Xerox regarding changes for our plans in 2006 .
xerox is not anticipating making any changes to the post - 65 plans in the area of Prescription Drugs . xerox also suggests NOT signing up for the Medicare plan D program if you are covered under the post - 65 xerox coverage as your benefit under xerox is cheaper & better .
basicly , xerox expects modest increases in 2006 in both the pre - 65 & post - 65 Flex plan premiums . for more details go to ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) and log in .
chairman of A.R.X.E. suggests working under and within the xerox plans for mutual benefit as costs saved for one plan will be saved for all plans and other corporations are having some premium reductions because the participants utilize their plans better than xerox does . and xerox's model and costs are exactly the same as theirs .
more details coming out in our next benefits newsletter .
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A.R.X.E. just posted under their FAQ section a note regarding their suggestions regarding the new Medicare Part " D " benefit available january 1 , 2006 .
all xerox retirees will be receiving a " creditable coverage " letter from xerox this fall before the Medicare enrollment period explaining " that the Xerox Prescription Drug Benefit for Medicare eligible retirees is equal to or better than the Medicare Part " D " benefit "
suggest those that are members , go to our site and log in . others , wait until xerox puts out this information later this fall in our enrollment packages or our next benefit newsletter .
by the way , this frequently asked questions tab on the left screen has really been " fleshed out " and i highly recommend going through this entire section , not just this Medicare Plan " D " part , to refresh yourself with our benefits and the federal / IRS rules & regulations regarding these benefits . A.R.X.E. suggests you go through this FAQ section BEFORE you contact xerox or A.R.X.E. about a question on your benefits . this data base will continue to grow and A.R.X.E. welcomes members input to make this section more meaningful and better .
it's been awhile since i've pitched A.R.X.E. membership , but i would think it should obvious that membership brings benefits that are well worth the $10 bucks a year . one benefit is being able to access this information well before xerox puts it out later to us retirees . you can join on line at : http://www.arxe.org
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hello kilo ,
i'm not on any prescriptions , but a retired xeroid friend of mine who is says the drug coverage he gets through his xerox post - 65 medical plan is excellent . he isn't a member of ARXE :( , and when i called him the other day to inform him not to sign up for Medicare's plan " D " drug coverage cause xerox's was better , he said he had already figured that out for himself when he studied the new drug care coverage in the national press .
and because xerox is actually advising people NOT to sign up for the new plan " D " , that encourages me that xerox will continue to offer us retiree coverage in the future . :) .
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Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association :
http://www.amfanatl.com[/url]
thought the other side of this issue should be presented too as most of the national press seems to favor Northwest Airlines . looks like this union services alot of other carriers too .
this site has alot of links helpful to union members for their COBRA medical coverage and unemployment claims and other factors helpful when their paychacks run out .
not sure how their pension plan works , but i heard one Northwest spouse on a radio investment program that was advised to take her lumpsum and roll it into an IRA .
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hi kilo ,
looks like a good site for future reference too .
thanks
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web site for the ' other ' machinists union at Northwest Airlines :
http://www.iamaw.org[/url]
this link seems to be the heart of the dispute :
http://www.goiam.org/content.cfm?cID=5084[/url]
read both letters . makes for very interesting reading . adobe reader required .
sure hate to have my career and pension & retirement tied up in a squabble between these two union bosses . ? :( ?
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sounds like a good case of self destruct. union solidarity makes for good talk, but it doesn't seem to be practiced
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hi kilo ,
i couldn't believe the letter myself . the first one was short and to the point , " appreciate your support " . the second letter was not so short and was more to the point , " shove it cause of the way you treated us in the past and you're on your own " .
reminds me of those who didn't support a xerox union cause they had a bad experience with a union in the past . as they say , there's good unions and there's ' not so good ' unions . fortunately , my wife's union has treated her pretty good and they have kept quite a bit of union work , although they did agree to come down on their demands for money and benefits and work rules .
i'll keep in touch with the airline situation cause i figure it won't last this year and the handwriting seems to be on the wall . just feel sorry for the employees and their pensions and retirement that are dragged down in this thing .
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hi allen,
i earned a degree in economics, courtesy of Xerox, and i 've always been a believer of adam smith's "invisable hand". so all those years when we said auto workers and airline workers earn too much we just had to wait for a little adjustment. it's just a shame that so many lives have to be affected. we will still have the same number of cars and people will still fly so those workers will still have work available, it's just that they won't be working for the big three, or the major airlines
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you're right kilo , the real shame of this isn't the company versus union thing , but the effect that this will have on employees / retirees and their retirement / pensions / lump sums / retiree benefits .
my own retirement is soooooo nice that i hate :( to see others not enjoy theirs too . especially when they've done all the other right things such as saved and put aside money for a " rainy " day ; and the only thing that keeps them from it is a STUPID union / company fight .
it'll be interesting to watch . stay tuned cause i'll continue to cover it cause our own retiree benefits could be next and the free education we're getting now watching these poor other suckers lose their retirement will assist us later if we have to make decisions similar to what some others are having to make now .
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just received today in my snail mail , a letter dated August 25th from the Xerox Benefits Center regarding my dependant confirmation on matterofchoice's web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] )
just came from the web site and did as the letter instructed and i received a " confirmation number " and printed the web page that confirmed my wife as my spouse and her continued medical / dental coverage in the future .
suggest you married guys do the same for yourself and / or kids . there is a deadline of september 20th for those with incorrect dependants listed . otherwise if a future audit catches you , you are responsibile for the false claims amounts paid .
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received an email confirmation last nite from the Benefits Center aknowledging my dependant confirmation yesterday on the matterofchoice web site . email stated i would receive a hard copy letter via snail mail stating same shortly . it'll be handy to have for future problem solving if i run into difficulties during my upcoming open enrollment period later this fall .
for those of you who haven't done so , the deadline for doing so is september 20th . sure would be nice for you married guys with or without kids to already have your dependants already correctly listed in your open enrollment materials when they show up in your mail box . word to the wise is usually enough . save ya lot of hastle and phone time later .
p.s. you'll know when you've done the process correctly when you get a " confirmation " number , a " print " screen to print out your selection , and a popup that asks for your email address to sent you a email confirmation later .
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the guy sticking around just because of his place on the seniority list is playing with fire, he stands to lose a lot,why does he think that the seniority list is getting so thin.
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hi kilo ,
sorry for the delay in this reply , but i just returned from a real estate trip .
you're so right on the pilot hoping the senority list is going to mean a dang thing to the PBGC when it comes time to figure out his new pension under their rules . he must not have read the different links i've provided here for you guys .
if he loses his lump sum because Delta gos bankrupt before he can get it , he can kiss it goodbye forever cause there is NO lumpsum money to pay anyone whose pension plan PBGC takes over .
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just returned from a couple of days absence from my keyboard to find in my snail mail my september , 2005 issue of my " You and Xerox : Benefit News for Xerox Retirees " .
this issue is a good reference to keep for later study and discusses at length the Medicare Prescription Drug coverage , how benefits are paid for Medicare - Eligible ( UnitedHealthcare ) members , quick guide to our Xerox Benefits Center , and payment options for your Xerox Retirement plans .
although this issue isn't available on ARXE's web site yet ( i'll let you know when it is ) , it is available on our matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com ) . adobe reader ( PDF. files ) required . this is a twelve ( 12 ) page issue . enjoy
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A.R.X.E. ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) contributes $1,500 to the hurricane Katrina relief effort .
way to go guys & gals :) .
this is a fairly big deal for ARXE as they only had less than $15,000.00 left in their reserves for 2005 according to their last budget report . and that's not a heck of a lot of money left to run a national organization like ARXE .
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Xerox's matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) has shown under the " Health Plan Comparison " tab , a 2006 medical & dental plan comparison for several weeks now . in the past , as recent as yesterday , that link didn't work . it does now for those interested .
IF the data presented is correct , Aetna is still the only high deductable plan offered ( for me anyway ? ) for next year ( 2006 ) . still no prices yet on the 2006 plans . stay tuned
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by the way , as of this morning , the dental plans offered for 2006 still does not work yet , and i will post that information when it does . the medical plan info did still work today , but still no prices yet for 2006 . stay tuned
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Allen
I am relatively new to this forum and I want to thank you for the continued stream of very valuable information that you provide. It is important that you know even though there may not be a lot of replys or comments added; your efforts are greatly appreciated. You correctly shed light on the facts that affect us all, current and retired 'X' employees; the actions of the PBGC, the airlines, union's impact on a company's viability and more. We must all be alert and vote on legislators in local, state & federal positions that will ultimately affect our financial well being for the duration of our lives. And I plan to be around a long time.
So... thanks and keep it up.
Drifter
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hello drifter ,
welcome to our band of xeroids . appreciate your thoughts . the stream of information is mostly bad news now and the present focus is on airlines cause they're on the cusp of industry change right now , just as xerox was years ago when they began downsizing . at least xerox had multiple early outs to assist those employees who were intelligent enough to take them and has maintained a fully funded pension plan and continues to offer retiree medical coverage . although there are those who would say the cost of that retiree medical coverage is more than xerox promised years ago , it is still at less expense than some other retiree plans and offers more choices than most . at least to my knowledge and those other company plan retirees i've spoken to .
my attempts are to educate those present and future retirees so that when they face similar decisions in their transition to retirement , that they don't choose the wrong path and lose their retirement as we see so many other workers do now . sometimes it's not their fault as they are swept along with history . but , often individual employees / retirees do have individual choices to make along the way . and the purpose of this forum is to assist them in making that decision the best for their future .
please don't feel that this is my personal blog , although it often seems so . this is YOUR forum and was started by me for the purpose to educate us present and future retirees , so feel free to add to the discussion and post . haven't edited or chamged anything here yet although the discussion does get lively at times when ex-xeroids complain . :) .
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Allen
I am relatively new to this forum and I want to thank you for the continued stream of very valuable information that you provide. It is important that you know even though there may not be a lot of replys or comments added; your efforts are greatly appreciated. You correctly shed light on the facts that affect us all, current and retired 'X' employees; the actions of the PBGC, the airlines, union's impact on a company's viability and more. We must all be alert and vote on legislators in local, state & federal positions that will ultimately affect our financial well being for the duration of our lives. And I plan to be around a long time.
So... thanks and keep it up.
Drifter
Allen
I am relatively new to this forum and I want to thank you for the continued stream of very valuable information that you provide. It is important that you know even though there may not be a lot of replys or comments added; your efforts are greatly appreciated. You correctly shed light on the facts that affect us all, current and retired 'X' employees; the actions of the PBGC, the airlines, union's impact on a company's viability and more. We must all be alert and vote on legislators in local, state & federal positions that will ultimately affect our financial well being for the duration of our lives. And I plan to be around a long time.
So... thanks and keep it up.
Drifter
I check on a daily basis for new info. First time posting , still a xerox employee .
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welcome xeroid ,
i encourage you to join A.R.X.E. ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) as an additional source of Xerox retiree information and to visit matterofchoice ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) and pick the " future retiree " link to view your future options .
and , of course , as a current xerox employee , you also have assess to the xerox / hewitt web site ( http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox[/url] ) for additional information . i found hewitt to be particularily helpful in my transition from employment to retirement . so develop a dialog with them .
good luck in your future retirement . the benefits aren't as nice as they were in the past , but still better than some other companies . let us know how you do as sharing with others here your experiences is the purpose of this forum . don't reinvent the wheel here as there have been others who have retired before you and there will be others after you so feel free to share and ask questions cause if i don't have an answer , i'm sure others here do .
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hi allen,
i would also like to welcome drifter and xeroid, but wonder has anyone heard from boatbum?
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Kilo,
Thanks for the concern for my well being...Actually, I have just been "lurking" recently and not contributing..
We made the move to Florida from California in late May, made an offer on a house in early June, moved in on June 30, and have been a having ball ever since..We are located behind the 10th green of a great golf and country club...Once my wife let me off the hook from moving and decorating and shopping for furniture I have been busy getting my golf game back in shape..Also, we have been doing a lot of kayaking...This area of the state is one of the greatest flatwater kayaking areas I have ever seen, spring fed rivers and great saltwater kayaking on the gulf side which is only about an hour away..We really haven't been very serious about anything except having fun since we got here..
I haven't missed much on the forums except for the first month when I had to scramble around for internet access...Once we got moved and the DSL was in, we are back up to speed...Just been way too busy to do much except read the forum..
The invite is out for you to stop by on your way to south Florida...We are only about a mile or so from I-75, just north of Ocala...
Boatbum
:D
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thoughts on healthcare :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/13520/1128133[/url]
i spend quite a bit of time on suite101 on investment forums . this popped up and i thought you might be interested . hopefully the links in the post work for ya . Kirk is the webmaster for the site and pretty much runs the investment portion of the site by himself . so if you decide to visit there often , you'll know who he is . hopefully most of the links in this post are still valid and will work for ya . often my links expire too and i have to periodicly go through and delete some posts in our archives because of that fact .
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healthcare costs :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/13520/1128236[/url]
Normxxx is a good friend of mine on suite101 and has turned me on to many good books to read on investing .
i think if you compare what others pay for their healthcare costs , you'll see where our Xerox coverage is a good deal . just my opinion of course and as i've always said , if you can get it cheaper some where else , do it . :)
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thoughts on Starbucks , coffee , and healthcare :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/13520/1128645[/url]
as the man says , " ...... non - sustainable "
just thoughts
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other thoughts on healthcare costs :
http://www.suite101.com/print_message.cfm/...g/13520/1128885[/url]
xerox , and other corporate healthcare providers have found that the more individual people are involved , including the expenses , in their health care decisions , the cheaper and better their individual health care is .
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interesting reading on pension plans @nytimes.com / the new york times business section
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hello sellat11 ,
you're right that the nytimes has alot of interesting articles and i have given alot of nice links to the new york times articles in the past . unforunately , they are adopting a policy of charging for viewing and getting links to their future articles so i doult i will give many of their links any more .
and that is the trend so future links from periodic publications will be more and more problematical . i'm already registered with so many different web sites that my personal email that i delete is getting bigger and bigger . but that's the price of extensive web surfing today .
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pension trends :
http://money.cnn.com/2005/09/15/retirement/pensions[/url]
unfortnately readers of this forum are more than aware of this article's facts . the trend in " defined benefit " - pensions isn't good . however you can take your lumpsum payout and create your own pension .
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Allan,
Nothing like getting a little payback for all the years that we paid into the system...Nice little SS check is autodeposited on the 3rd Tuesday of every month for me..Covers my golf habit..Life is good and retirement is great..
Boatbum :D
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hi boatbum ,
nice to hear you're doing well . big ' O ' 's buddy , clayton and his wife both collect social security checks and they say between the two checks , they don't need much else from their investments to live . having a automatic deposit into my checking account will bring back memories of when xerox used to do that . i was looking at my annual statement and if my check is as big as they state it will be , i'll get something like a + 12% return on the lumpsum total i paid into the system . beats a regular annunity payment of + 5% to + 6% that xerox was going to give me from my 401(k) for a pension . course , the new social security formula isn't supposed to be so generous . glad i'm old enough to make it under the old calculation formula .
i don't golf , but retirement is very nice . can't believe how nice it is sometimes . i rv here in the summer in alaska getting real estate ready to sell and getting ready to journey to my winter home in hawaii next month where i'll surf every morning .
looking forward to our retiree medical coverage open enrollment choices next month . wonder how long that's going to last . ? ?
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with all the airlines going chap 11 and Airbus breathing down their neck it's not a good time to play tough.
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agree with ya kilo , but big Labor ( unions ) don't necessarily follow the national news like us little folks do . usually labor can only see their side of the issue . and usually their members are in agreement with them on the constant struggle with the company .
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when i first got out of the service i when through the trials of a very volatile electonics industry, so in a job search i limited myself to blue chips like Xerox and IBM, Xerox was the lucky winner and i can honestly say that in 30 years i never looked at the want ads
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hello kilo ,
sorry for the delay in getting back to you , but i was out of town a couple of days on real estate business .
you know , with the 28 years i worked for xerox , PLUS the 5 years since i've been retired , and god knows how many years of retirement i'll have in the future ; i could set a new record for not looking at the want ads in the future . :) . cause i sure don't plan on ever working again . ' work ' is a four letter word to me now .
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for those interested , the matter of choice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) now shows the dental plans available for 2006 too as well as the 2006 medical plans . my particular log-in screen ( probably different than someone else's because of the plans available to me that might not be available to someone else in another part of the country ) shows :
Aetna DMO In-Network , Aetna DMO Out-of Network , MetLife Dental In-Network , MetLife Dental Out-of-Network
the direct comparison on one single screen , side by side , is interesting . no prices yet . lets one do some homework before our open enrollment choices later this month .
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pension reform legislation :
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/09/opinion/09sun1.html[/url]
this gives more details on the legislation presently before congress . this article states as i've already stated , the important elements ISN'T as it affects the airlines , but as it pertains to the many other companies who need pension regulations to keep their pension plans funded .
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IMPORTANT **************** important ****************** IMPORTANT
just received my October issue of the , " You and Xerox : Benefits News for Xerox Retirees " in my snail mail this morning . neither matterofchoice or arxe have this issue posted yet . when they do , i will post those links HERE on this message so check back .
* above newsletter has been posted on the ARXE web site : http://www.arxe.org[/url]
xerox is offering pretty much the same plans as they did last year and ACTUALLY increasing the plans offered to include a " Blended " plan for those with specifc additional needs not covered by their past offerings of " High - Moderate - and Low deductable " health care plans . there are still no specific prices yet , but from the reading of the " 2006 Maximum Contribution for Retiree or Spouse / Domestic Partner Coverage " , it looks like the prices are still very good , if not pretty much the same as last year . xerox has also increased the offerings for Spouse / Domestic partners to provide them with increased protections with or without their partners . and xerox offers a schedule of services covered by a $20 copayment under the low deductable , moderate deductible , and blended options when preformed in network .
those of you who follow my forum realize that i often add to a particular post well after i've posted the first edition / thread / message and as i read and reread this issue , i will continue to add to this post instead of generating a new post so check back .
open enrollment begins october 31st and expires november 18th and the enrollment materials will be sent out end of this month so stay tuned .
we are entering my favorite season of the year as our open enrollment approaches . i really enjoy going over my benefits package offerings and keeping up with how xerox is doing " honoring their promises " to us retirees . and although it's not exactly the same promise i hear when i retired , it still beats any , if not all , retiree plans i've followed . and especially in light of recent bankruptcy news and pension plans being taken over by PBGC , which includes ZERO retiree benefits . and my wife is very happy reading over her coverage options too . and if my wife is happy , i'm happier :) . at this point in time , my retiree health care benefits are still my best benefit from my xerox career .
the new ' Blended ' option being offered includes ....... " some services , such as office visits and outpatient surgery , are covered by a copayment when performed in network . " " Other services , such as inpatient care , are subject to the plan deductable and coinsurance . " " For services covered by copayments . you don't have to meet a deductable , so these out-of-pocket expenses are more predictable . " " But there is a cost for this predictability : the price for the Blended option is higher than for the Low and Moderate Deductable options . "
post - 65 medical options now available to pre - 65 spouses / domestic partners who are medicare - eligible . " For 2006 , the full range of pre - 65 and post - 65 Xerox medical options will be available for the first time to pre - 65 spouses / domestic partners who are eligible for Medicare , typically as a result of disability . " " In addition , the Benefits Allowance for your pre - 65 spouse / domestic partner will be reduced to the post - 65 level , which is HALF of the pre - 65 Benefits Allowance for spouses / domestic partners . "
schedule of services covered by a $20 copayment under the low deductable , moderate deductable , and blended options when preformed in network . " So for 2006 , we're introducing a clearly defined ' schedule of services ' covered by copayments under the low deductible , moderate deductible , and blended options . " there is a long list of services that would only cost $20 under the above restrictions . list is too long to cover here , but starts with ' physical exams ' and ends with ' urinalysis ' and includes certain routine screenings and hearing exams to include ' well child ' and ' well women ' exams . xerox suggests that you " contact your health plan directly for more information on specific covered services and age / frequency limitations . " and these " must be performed in accorance with the age and frequency guidelines outlined by the U.S. Preventive Services Task Force . "
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Allan, thanks for the update on the retiree medical enroolment. I am quickly approaching the retiree state and am trying to educate myself on the benefits and financial well being.
I ran across this Wall Street Journal article today and think that the readers of this post will be interested. Consistent with many articles over this last year, retiree benefits and pensions are subject to radical change ( read: reduced) is some instances and the health of the PBGC is key to thousands of retirees. I am afraid that a taxpayer PBGC bailout in the billions of dollars may be in our future as the pyramid affect of supporting retiree benefits/pensions through current employee deductions and/or business expansion fails to be able to fund retiree requirements. Does Social Security funding come to mind?
Anyway, here is the article for your reading pleasure.
drifter
The Oracle of Delphi
Delphi's bankruptcy filing is ominous enough as the largest in the history of the American automotive industry. But it also lives up to the company's mythological name in what it portends for the auto industry, not to mention the pension burdens that may soon be foisted on the American taxpayer.
This is a story about globalization and the increasingly unsustainable expense of traditional business health and pension benefits in the U.S. But it is also about an industry -- and here management and unions share the blame -- that allowed its cost structure to grow out of all proportion to its productivity, making a retrenchment inevitable.
A Delphi worker who earns $25 an hour actually costs an average of $65 an hour once retirement and health-care benefits are factored in. It is these open-ended benefits packages that make any rationalization of the auto industry's cost structure so difficult. Six-year-old Delphi, with 12,000 union retirees compared with 185,000 employees world-wide, can count itself fortunate. GM has more than one million retirees and dependents to provide for, against a global payroll of 317,000.
Over the weekend, CEO Robert S. Miller described Delphi's business plan as trying to "outrun" its legacy costs through growth and the attrition of the workers (and union contracts) it inherited when it was spun off from GM in 1999. The idea was that GM would reabsorb some of Delphi's workers as GM's payroll needs increased.
Delphi would then grow by taking on new workers at lower, more competitive wages -- in some cases, less than half the $25 an hour that the legacy workers were entitled to under GM's contracts with the United Auto Workers union. In 2004, Delphi secured that right under a new contract with the UAW, but it has hired too few people under the new terms to make much of a dent in its cost structure.
This is, in part, because Delphi itself has never grown much since the spin-off. It has added new business, reducing its reliance on GM orders. But GM has shrunk over the past six years, meaning Delphi was mostly running to stand still. GM's shrinkage has also meant that it never needed those workers who were supposed to "flow back" to the parent company; it has some 5,000 workers in its "jobs bank," laid-off unionized employees who are essentially sitting around waiting for the phone to ring and costing GM $750 million a year. Delphi has 4,000 employees in its own jobs bank. Mr. Miller puts the cost of paying them to do nothing at $400 million a year even as its unfunded pension liabilities have climbed toward $4.5 billion.
It was in this context that Mr. Miller sought 60% pay cuts from the unions in the run-up to last weekend's bankruptcy filing. Under a court-supervised reorganization, he will presumably get those concessions. But even so, it is likely that a substantial number of the 33,000 unionized Delphi employees in the U.S. will lose their jobs. Three-quarters of the 185,000 people Delphi employs are outside the U.S., with one-third in Mexico. The reorganization will likely result in a company even more heavily tilted toward its overseas operations.
Whatever the ultimate outcome, Delphi's bankruptcy likely marks the death knell for the expansive system of defined-benefit retirement packages that auto workers have long enjoyed. Those benefits were negotiated for a growing industry that is no longer growing, and, as in the steel industry before it, the numbers no longer add up in the car business.
This is, as union leaders said in response to the filing, an extremely bitter pill for the workers. But the truth is that this kind of benefit system was probably never a good idea to begin with, even if it was a good deal for some people for some time. Defined-contribution retirement plans, such as 401(k)s, may put more of the onus on workers to both save for retirement and manage their own investments. But they also give workers an asset that their employers can't take away -- and one that they can take with them if they jump to another job or a different industry.
Mr. Miller has defied expectations by denying he intends to dump Delphi's pension obligations on the Pension Benefit Guarantee Corp., the government pension insurer of last resort for companies that can't meet their obligations. He notes that of the 10 restructuring efforts he's led, only one -- Bethlehem Steel -- resulted in flipping the pensions to Uncle Sam. On the other hand, Mr. Miller noted, the PBGC is technically an unsecured creditor under bankruptcy rules; other creditors would have to agree to hold the PBGC harmless in the restructuring in order for Delphi to continue to pay those pensions.
Compared to the auto makers themselves, Delphi is a small fry as pension obligations go. And in the wake of the airline bankruptcies of the last year, the need for reform of the PBGC and the moral hazard it creates has become all the more apparent.
Legislation currently under consideration in Washington would allow the airlines to freeze their defined-benefit obligations at current levels while transitioning to a defined-contribution plan going forward. The legislation is far from perfect, but it's a step in the right direction. There's no reason it should be limited to the airlines, however; the auto industry is the much bigger kahuna here. And Delphi's filing is an omen of what's to come.
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no problem drifter . i'm still surprised that this october issue isn't showing up on the ARXE and the matterofchoice web sites yet . a guy'd be sunk without getting a copy in your snail mail . and my snail mail here in alaska and later hawaii next week is really slow too . i'll post those links on my message above when they finally come through .
congradulations on reaching retirement . never thought i'd make it here when i was struggling to keep my job with X . looks like i'll make social security next year too . then i join kilo on the ' dole ' .
appreciate your article . we can use all the input and education on the pension issues we can get here . hopefully xeroids won't have to deal with PBGC's pension formula and will continue to receive the ' higher of the three ' ( actually four ) figures and being able to take their lumpsums and continue to receive retiree medical / dental coverage . even post - 65 if they want .
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good article from drifter, can you imagine being stuck in a job that you hated just because of that defined pension hanging over you. hey allen, better hurry up and get on the dole, i can't promise that there'll be much left.
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yeah , specially when that ' defined pension ' fell apart on ya before you could get your hands on it and all those hated years you spent were wasted .
that's why i'm putting in for my social security sooner rather than later . the congress is too busy this year working on the pension issue to tackle the social security problem . when they do get around to the social security problem , those younger than 50 or 55 ( pick a number - any number ) won't get anywhere near what you've gotten or i'm likely to get out of the system next year . it'll be a different ball game with the new formula that's for sure . especially since there won't ' just ' be a pot there to draw from . it'll be just like the difference between a defined benefit / pension plan and a defined contribution / and ' you get what you and you alone have put in ' type plan . with social security most have put something in , but most get out of the plan much more than they ever put in . i will and you probably did . and most of our older seniors have put very little in and have gotten back much more . with a 401(k) , if you decide to not put much in , there dang sure won't be hardly anything there to pay you in the end . remember most employers are NOT as generous as xerox was and give you the ' higher of the three ' ( actually four ) amounts . with most defined contribution plans / 401(k)s , you get the ' cash balance ' , PERIOD . there is no calculation to give people an additional amount that they never earned or put into the system .
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ARXE http://www.arxe.org[/url] has posted a 11 page letter from Lawrence M. Becker , Director of Xerox Corporate Benenfits regarding the new Medicare Plan ' D ' Drug coverage that xerox has requested you decline . explanations are in the enclosure . members should check it out . $10 bucks a year keeps you in the ' know ' and helps to support your continued benefits from xerox .
with me being in my winter home in hawaii now and mail forwarding sometimes taking weeks to arrive here in the islands :( , it's nice to be able to read some of this stuff until my hard copy catches up to me snail mail . it's especially critical durning ' open enrollment ' time when i usually have to pick my choices before receiving my entire package and reading all of it before making my elections .
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received in my snail mail today a ' Annual Notification of Precertification and Step - Therapy List Changes ' letter from my retiree healthcare provider , Aetna . this is an updated list of new drugs or generic drugs that have just been made available . looks like it's over twelve or so . i'm not on any medication so it's all greek to me . :) . i'm sure if i were on medication , i'd appreciate being able to get it cheaper through Aetna or Xerox's other drug care provider , CareMark .
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just received a email from ARXE informing me that the 2006 enrollment packages were enroute . i won't receive mine for awhile yet as i'm now in my winter home in hawaii and forwarded mail takes at least a week to get from my permanent address in alaska to my temperary address in kona . i usually make my decisions based solely on what's offered on matterofchoice . com anyway .
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hi allen,
the wife has been pestering me to get her hands on the open enrollment package (like i had anything to do with it). we have presriptions and it's good to be able to talk to the doctor about options.
time magazine just had a very depressing article regarding retirees. thing are looking grim for those who don't save or stay healthy.
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hi kilo ,
sorry about being late on my reply to you , but i just returned from spending acouple of days in Hilo checking on real estate we own near Pahoa in Puna .
my wife likes to keep up with her benefits through Xerox too . she can't hardly wait until i turn 65 and then she has to sign up with Xerox / Hewitt / matterofchoice herself and make her own choices .
you're right about news about pensions / retirement isn't rosey . sometimes it's down right depressing to post some of this stuff ............. but i feel it helps to educate those who aren't aware how important it is to SAVE , INVEST , and not to follow the wrong ' drummer ' when it comes to some of these union / management disputes .
it's take me a day or so to get back in the grove and post again .
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ARXE has finally posted on their web site ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) the October 2005 issue of the You and Xerox : Benefits News for Xerox Retirees .
this newsletter has still not been posted yet on the matterofchoice web site , but there are two additional medical plans available for 2006 comparisons . they are the " Blended Options " for Blue Cross and Aetna . for those who presently have those plans and want a ' sneak peek ' at what may be available to you when open enrollment starts next week , you might log on to : ( <a href='http://www.matterofchoice.com' target='_blank'>http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) and check ' plan comparisons ' for 2006 . STILL NO PRICES YET .
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hi allen,
just got my booklet, with prices............little sticker shock at first, but all in all some decent choices, you do have to do some serious accounting and make some realistic projections, but i do think that they're trying to give us some viable options.
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hi kilo ,
thanks for sharing that information . now others can look for their own packages . in looking over the matterofchoice web site , there still isn't any prices yet , but they did change the ' question of the month ' to offering a explanation of Medical Plan provisions for retirees eligible for POST 65 health care . there are summaries of those now probably to include the new drug plan ' D ' that Xerox suggests Xerox retirees NOT sign up for .
and you're absolutely correct that our increased options make for increased ' thinking ' about our choices . actually it's a ' nice problem ' to have as most retirees have no choices or no retiree healthcare at all .
IMPORTANT ******************* important ******************** IMPORTANT
PRICES ARE NOW AVAILABLE ON THE MATTEROFCHOICE WEB SITE ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) FOR 2006 OPEN ENROLLMENT .
my monthly costs ( if i maintain my same Aetna high deductable plan ) went from $297.41 a month to $414.50 a month , or an increase of 39.369% . this includes my wife and i both and Metlife Dental . no vision .
would have been happier with less of an increase , but i'm still paying approximately HALF what most of my retired friends are paying with MORE choices . i'll let my wife independently study these various options taking her time this weekend , but i'm sure she'll be happy with the choices too . especially since POST - 65 , she gets to independently sign up and be offered this same coverage on her own EVEN in the event of my death . i'll make more comment as i get into the heart of this thing later . enjoy .
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hi kilo ,
thanks for sharing that information . now others can look for their own packages . in looking over the matterofchoice web site , there still isn't any prices yet , but they did change the ' question of the month ' to offering a explanation of Medical Plan provisions for retirees eligible for POST 65 health care . there are summaries of those now probably to include the new drug plan ' D ' that Xerox suggests Xerox retirees NOT sign up for .
and you're absolutely correct that our increased options make for increased ' thinking ' about our choices . actually it's a ' nice problem ' to have as most retirees have no choices or no retiree healthcare at all .
IMPORTANT ******************* important ******************** IMPORTANT
PRICES ARE NOW AVAILABLE ON THE MATTEROFCHOICE WEB SITE ( http://www.matterofchoice.com ) FOR 2006 OPEN ENROLLMENT .
my monthly costs ( if i maintain my same Aetna high deductable plan ) went from $297.41 a month to $414.50 a month , or an increase of 39.369% . this includes my wife and i both and Metlife Dental . no vision .
would have been happier with less of an increase , but i'm still paying approximately HALF what most of my retired friends are paying with MORE choices . i'll let my wife independently study these various options taking her time this weekend , but i'm sure she'll be happy with the choices too . especially since POST - 65 , she gets to independently sign up and be offered this same coverage on her own EVEN in the event of my death . i'll make more comment as i get into the heart of this thing later . enjoy .
If you select the High Deductible Aetna plan and applying the maximum contribution, the monthly is $312.50 for you and your wife. Is that correct?
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hello Elion ,
NO , that is not correct . :) it might be correct AFTER the ' maximum contribution ' formula is applied later .
if i select the Aetna high deductable plan , with Metlife dental , for the wife and I both , our annual costs are $4,974 , bottom line AFTER xerox substracts all their ' allowances ' or $414.50 a month . this is BEFORE xerox figures any of their ' maximum contribution ' formula into my total costs which might drop my annual expense , and monthly preminum slightly . ? ? i never can figure out my exact costs after the ' maximum contribution ' is taken into account until i get a final bill from xerox the beginning of each year . so the only thing i can go on now is the numbers i see in front of me on my screens . my numbers show if xerox paid NOTHING toward my retiree healthcare coverage , it would cost me $10,120 a year or $843.33 a month . which , by the way , some of my retired friends ARE paying for their health care . and some actually pay more .
but right now as i read my matterofchoice numbers going with the above , that's my personal numbers . healthcare expenses probably vary with individual geographic location and i know for a fact , healthcare costs in Alaska are higher than the national adverage . plus , in Alaska , i wouldn't also have some of the other healthcare providers that others may have close to larger cities with more hospitals , clinics , doctors , etc .
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second reply to Elion ,
upon further reflection , Elion gets his ' $312.50 ' monthly premium figure from looking at page six of our october issue of our ' Benefit News for Xerox Retirees ' . the top half of the page has the ' Maximum Contribution ' formula for figuring out the ' maximum ' amounts you will be required to pay under each option for 2006 . and in looking under the ' High Deductable option ' they have an amount of :
$1,650 for retiree
$2,100 for spouse / domestic partner
______
$3,750 divided by twelve months equals Elion's $312.50 .
this number doesn't take into consideration Dental , which for me is $642.00 annual cost divided by twelve months equals $53.50 a month added to $312.50 a month equals $366.00 a month .
i hope that's my final number , but until i get the final confirmation bill for 2006 , the only thing i can count on for sure is my original calculation based on what my matterofchoice screen shows now of $414.50 a month .
i'll let ya know Elion if you're correct when i get my final number . hope you are .
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Allan,
We went with the Moderate Deductible Blue Cross/Blue Shield which, I might add, we have been very very pleased with in the past...We also took the MetLife Dental plan and my numbers matched yours exactly, $366 per month...That is actually less than what we paid last year because we had the Low Deductible Blue Cross/Blue Shield this year and never even met our deductible so we decided to gp from Low tp High...In the long run the numbers add up to the same bottom line figure...If you stay healthy you save money, if not it still rolls out to the same no matter which one you choose..
I'm hoping that the $366 figure holds up...Guess we will know soon..
Boatbum
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hi boatbum ,
agree with you about the $366 dollar figure holding up . sometimes i wonder why our matterofchoice open enrollment page is set up the way it is , if , in the end , xerox is going to go with the ' maximum contribution ' number anyway . but i guess you have to start with an objective numerical starting place anyway and then work from there . ? ? and hopefully work dowwards :) from there .
if my ' back of the envelope calculations ' are correct , it may be beneficial to go with a ' high ' deductable medical plan just to be able to open one of these HSAs and use tax free , income tax deductable money to pay for those medical expenses i do have to pay for myself anyway no matter which plan i have . ? ?
i'll know more later on that this week hopefully .
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submitted my enrollment on matterofchoice for another year with Aetna's high deductable medical plan and Metlife's dental plan . received a ' confirmation ' email . have had quite a bit of experience with Metlife and i like our dentist . have had ZERO experience with Aetna yet so can't comment on them . also signed up online for Aetna's HSA ( Health Savings Account ) and posted those links in a post on the new topic that ' Toner ' started . will call Aetna in the morning to verify / confirm that my online application went through o.k.
i'll let ya'll know what my final prices are when xerox figures my ' maximum contribution ' calculation into my annual / monthly premium .
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received a email today from A.R.X.E. informing me of a post dated today , november 2nd , in the '' Chairman's Cornor ' from the chairman , Dave Coriale , on our open enrollment process . it's worth reading . especially the part that the numbers we see on our open enrollment screens and enrollment materials received in the mail DOES NOT include the ' maximum contribution ' reductions that normally happen . so wait until you see that figure before you panic .
Dave also gives some excellent advice on opting out of the xerox medical plans if you're of a mind and how to reinstate your self if you do so .
overall , worth checking out at : ( http://www.arxe.org ) .
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the ' question of the month ' on the sign in screen for the matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) has been changed to :
Q - " Where can I find discriptions of the medical plan provisions for Medicare eligible retiree ? ?
A - " click on the ' Plan Information ' above . Use the link entitled ' Post 65 Healthcare Plan Summaries '
i usually find when a web site draws attention to a section of their site tool bar , it's usually because they've made additions or changed it so you post - 65 retirees might want to recheck it out .
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just received a personal email message through Xertech from one of our members , Dwtn Don , asking me what i thought of his new web site . and he gave me a couple of links in his message :
http://www.xerox-service.com/forum1/[/url]
the other link was to his main board :
http://www.xerox-service.com/[/url]
well Don , as to what i honestly think of your site , i'm the ninth registered member of your forums and await my further instructions to be able to fully partake and post on your new site . for my purposes , your ' Retiree Area ' would probably be of the greatest interest to me . but i really have my hands full here at Xertech so don't plan on doing the same extensive work there that i do here , but i may in the future . i certainly will add your site to my favorites list and will visit you and other xeroids there often i hope .
thanks for the invite and i encourage others here at xertech to visit your site
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A.R.X.E. has posted a comment by the A.R.X.E. chairman , Dave Coriale , on the ' Flex Plan Benefits Acceleration ' option offered in our open enrollment . A.R.X.E. has not taken an offical stance on this option , and feel it's up to each member to decide for themselves , BUT , Dave did mentioned , for himself , it's NOT a good bet to make an ' IRREVOCABLE ' choice to opt yourself out of post - 65 medical benefits to save money pre - 65 . and i agree .
the A.R.X.E. is getting alot of emails because of the higher costs of retiree medical plans and some members are looking at their options to cut their costs .
Dave reminds members that the total annual price tag we see is BEFORE the ' maxium contributions ' formula is applied and that the final premium will probably be lower depending on each person's circumstances . in my particular case i never used my LifeCycle Assistance benefit amount of $10k that was available to me my entire career and that dollar amount is now applied to my healthcare cost premium over my remaining life time ( amortized ) . so another xeroid may not have that full dollar amount left to apply to his remaining healthcare costs and his final costs could be different than mine .
plus when we xerox retirees went through our first large increase in our retiree medical care plans several years ago , i choose a higher deductable plan to cut my own costs .
kilo and i had a conversation on this very topic last year at open enrollment time . please refer to our archives ( thank you :) xertech ) for posts of October 23rd at 3:10pm & October 26th at 2:23pm of 2004 . you can also read previous and later posts around those dates to get a better idea of what we are talking about at this time now . members of A.R.X.E. please read the chairman's comments on the web site ( http://www.arxe.org ) . and others with questions regarding this option , please feel free to ask questions or state your opinions here . we have new people coming on board and ' newbies ' retiring all the time , so nows the time to ask and get these questions / concerns answered cause there's many of us older retirees here who've already had to decide some of these exact same issues for ourselves . and this particular question / choice is certainly alittle more important than the usual choices at open enrollment , cause as the chairman said in his comment , this decision is IRREVOCABLE and you won't get the opportunity to change your mind when open enrollment comes around again next year if you decide to take this accelerated option .
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received today in my forwarded mail my personal enrollment materials . i'll be going through it and making comments later . i notice that xerox commented on page 4 that they were going to cap our benefit allowance in 2003 and it wasn't supposed to increase , however xerox decided to implement maximum contributions for most options for this year again .
xerox also warns us that our contributions for our healthcare will increase as xerox's subsidy will be limited to the Benefits Allowance shown on our worksheets . and warns us that expenses will continue to raise in the future .
and apparantly there was a special subsidy from the federal government ( CMS ) that was applied to our costs too . and xerox also states they may or may not continue to use this subsidy for individual benefit reduction in the future .
page 19 gos into detail how our LifeCycle Allowance applies towards our medical coverage costs depending on the time frame you retired . and as i suspected , because of the time frame i retired , my wife / spouse will also be allowed to use my / our LifeCycle Allowance in the event of my death . retirees on or AFTER January 1st , 2003 do not continue to receive this benefit . another key date mentioned is weither you retired on or after January 1st , 2005 .
page 21 has a detailed description of the ' accelerated benefits ' that A.R.X.E. mentioned on their web site . and i noticed that xerox said ' more than once ' , ......." by electing Benefits Allowance acceleration for yourself and / or your spouse / domestic partner , you waive your and / or your spouses's / domestic partner's eligibility for a Benefits Allowance and Xerox Medical coverage at age 65 and after . "
page 22 has a " Special Section for Medicare Eligible Members " and most of us that aren't there yet , will get there at some point and it's worth reading even if you're not 65 yet . probably the biggest topic of importance here to wives is the part about ' creating separate accounts for wives ' after certain events happen .
page 30 mentions Health Savings Accounts , a subject worthy of it's own topic here on the Retiree News forum started by ' Toner ' ( thanks again :) Toner ) . HSAs are ONLY available to those participants in the Aetna High Deductable plan and you can NOT have a HSA and a Health Care Account . i have requested HSA paperwork from Aetna and expect to make a pro - rated contribution for this year ( 2005 ) and a full contribution for next year ( 2006 ) . see our HSA topic for further updates on this new program available through xerox .
there is more detailed instructions for post - 65 retirees in this year's package . there are detailed side - by side explanations of each plan offered . booklet is 59 pages in length and is probably a good reference for later use because it explains in detail how xerox's various plans work . i have hi - lited various sections for myself and my wife for quicker reference in the future and my wife is reading this xerox publication from cover to cover to get herself up to speed in the event i'm not around to explain xerox's thinking and changes they've gone through over the years . cause we all know sometimes ' promises ' change over time .
feel free to comment or ask questions here on open enrollment . we've only got until november 18th to make our choices . after that date it's alot more difficult to make changes .
stay tuned
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FASB looks to change it's pension rules :
http://www.fasb.org/news/nr111005.shtml[/url]
Financial Accounting Standards Board looks to begin changing their standards for pensions starting next year .
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more on pension accounting standards :
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/11/business/11fasb.html[/url]
and the article is correct about this having far reaching effects on company balance sheets and their ' bottom lines ' .
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hi allen,
looking at my open enrollment max contributions and find that my contributions for mod ded and hi ded are the same.........sounds odd to me
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i noticed that too kilo . however i didn't want to make any statements based on assumptions based on the ' maximum ' formula . first and lastly , i have great difficulty assuming that the ' maximum contribution ' formula is going to be my final annual / monthly premium costs until i see that in writing in my final statement for next year's expenses to me . i know it states that in the open enrollment book . but i still have difficulty accepting that as my bill until i can verify it . also , i decided to continue with my ' high ' deductable plan though to qualify for the HSA i want to open and get some additional tax write-offs and be able to spend tax free money against any deductables i may have no matter what plan i'm in .
and after i get my Tubotax installed on my computer and can run some numbers , i can confirm my feeling that my HSA deduction may actually be a ' tax credit ' that is even better than a tax deduction because it comes off your tax return as a credit against any taxes owed . in other words , right off the top against any taxes i owe , no matter what those taxes are owed for . but , i haven't confirmed that yet .
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A.R.X.E. just posted on their web site ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) a post on the Pacificare Secure Horizons option offered to some in Xerox's open enrollment . suggest those who are members go to our site and check it out .
AND don't forget that our open enrollment deadline ends TOMORROW .
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just received a personal email from Eric about the Xertech outage . i again offered him my fifty $ dollar bill he wouldn't take before . :) .
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the ' question of the month ' on our matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com[/url] ) has changed and is timely and important right about now :
Q. " Does the final cost calculation on the back of my enrollment worksheet reflect the maximum contribution cap ? "
A. " No , it does not . Because your final cost varies depending on several factors ........"
the answer then gos into all the factors that make up your final cost calculation . there will be a final ' confirmation statement ' released in eary december . we'll get our individual numbers then at that time . i'll share with this board my exact numbers and how that compared with earlier numbers i already posted for my open enrollment calculation cost for 2006 .
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B)
Allan thaks for all the good info , started to look at the sites , lots to consider
BOB L
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hi BOB L ,
no problem . there absolutely is alot to consider about traveling to Hawaii durning our ' winter ' season . sometimes you can get flights out of the west coast for $300 round trip . i hear there's also a charter carrier that flies out of Vancover , Canada straight to our Keahole International ( KOA ) airport here in Kona , Hawaii that probably offers pretty good airfares . plus , they'd be used to dealing with your currency and probably offer you car and room packages too in addition to your air fare .
i fly through a charter outfit on straight flights out of Anchorage , Alaska ( less than a $20 cab ride for me from my condo there ) to Hawaii . their web site is : ( http://www.hawaiianvacations.com[/url] ) . i've been flying with these guys over 20 years now and it allows me to SKIP the west coast entirely and arrive in Hawaii in the same 5 1/2 hour flight as if i had left Seattle , San Francisco , or L. A . they fly two to three days a week year round and offer more flights in the winter . i usually have to fly through Honolulu or Maui when i go with them , but most interisland flights are less than an hour in length and they leave Honolulu pretty much every hour so if you're late for one interisland flight , you're early for the next one .
if you check these different airlines and travel agencies , you can get some pretty good deals . i've seen some $50 to $100 one way fares and some will book you a room for $50 more a nite . we stayed in honolulu one trip for four nites free in a excellent hotel near Waikiki and got a weekly bus pass for $15 dollars and saw pretty much all of O'ahu for that stay . and it only added $40 dollars on to my trip to Kona . saw Pearl Harbor , North Shore , China Town and didn't have to worry about the traffic or cost to park a car .
i'd use the web exclusively and really do alot of web surfing before i sent anybody / spent any of my money . you can usually uncover some pretty good deals . ' keep your stick on the ice ' :rolleyes: .
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Xerox freezes ' OLD PLAN ' retirees medicare reimbursement at 2005 level . check out the A.R.X.E. web site . http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) for details . the ARXE board will be reviewing this change .
looks like xerox was paying the ' OLD PLAN ' retirees part ' B ' premiums and will do so in the future ONLY at the 2005 rate into 2006 and beyond . this year's premium is $78.20 / monthly or $938 / annually . the retiree will be responsible for the future increases . they are automaticly taken out of most social security checks .
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Aloha BOB L ,
http://www.westhawaiitoday.com/articles/20.../local08txt.txt
ran across this in this morning's newspaper . if you decide to come visit this winter , bring your sunglasses . if you decide to stay in Canada , keep your stick on the ice . :lol: .
these guys will probably even take your ' loonies ' . :P .
http://www.aircanada.com/en/offers/air/haw...awaii_pass.html
:P Thanks will look into it
BOB L
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it's pearl harbor day, and a few years ago i was on I-495 behind a car that had two bumper stickers, one said "remember pearl harbor" and the other said "pearl harbor survivor".........the car was a honda.
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hello kilo ,
today's really a big day over here in Hawaii . i've been in Honolulu on December 7th and it's even bigger over there today . you see Pearl Harbor survivors wearing their ' Pearl Harbor Survivor ' hats all over the place .
my dad served in the Pacific in World War II and my uncle ( his brother ) was a Pearl Harbor survivor . and i'm a Navy Viet Nam vet so i can relate .
as far as the Japanese , it was a different era , a different generation . and they do make excellent vehicles . many of them in factories in the U.S. and pay top wages and benefits ( mostly NON - union ) . so hey , can't fight the ' globalization ' of the world . a brand new Ford Explorer i saw in a mall in Alaska had a manufactoring sticker in the window that said : Engine made in Germany , Transmission made in France , Body and parts assembled in Canada , and the whole thing put together in Tennesee . alot of Fords were put together in Mexico too .
the times they are ' a ' changing ' . :unsure:
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received a email last nite from A.R.X.E. ( http://www.arxe.org[/url] ) on their " Shareholder Proposals for 2006 " . they , ARXE , have done a good job of hiding this new information under the ' Shareholder Proposals 2006 ' on the left hand tab of their site . for members , it's worth digging and reading as it sounds like xerox isn't exactly being friendly again to retirees requests .
i would also like to point out the ' FAQ ' link on the site cause it is turning out to be a growing data base of excellent information . i learn something more about our benefits everytime i go back through it .
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i've got to agree with you, i'vew got two subarus (great in new england) both made in indiana. read the axre memo too and it does look like they're getting ready for a fight.....glad i paid my dues, by the way i'm an officer in the american legion, hope you consider joining, it's great to talk to the wwII vets.
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hello kilo ,
agree with ya about foreign automobiles . i owned a Isuzu diesel pickup for over 13 years and loved it . have a VW eurocamper van in Alaska right now and love it . looking seriously at a Mercedes Benz camper van with a diesel engine to replace my VW if Volkswagen doesn't put back into production their camper model when i'm ready for a new vehicle in a year or so . have a Mazda Tribute here in hawaii that i'm happy with , but i did have enough sales issues with Mazda & Ford ( they pretty much own Mazda ) that i may never buy another Mazda / Ford product again . ? ?
i got the same impression when i read the ARXE memo too . and i don't think it's so much an ' issues ' fight as it is an ' attitude ' thing . i'm very glad to send ARXE my sawbuck every year and get the ' inside ' skinny on what's happening with my retiree benefits . i'm just hoping i can get to Medicare ( post - 65 ) age before any more major changes are made to our retiree medical coverage .
went down to the VFW once , but found out quickly that there are hardly any vets past the WW II and Korean War time frame . definitely very few Viet Nam vets . it's funny , i see most Viet Nam vets in ' Hells Angles ' type motorcycle club gatherings than i do anywhere else :) . and see very few Desert War or Iraq war vets at all . seems like being a vet isn't as popular as some think . i don't care cause i went for my own reasons , but it does make for interesting and difficult conversations with some ' Hanoi Jane Fonda ' types . usually ends with a " we'll have to agree to disagree " type of comment . :) .
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the matterofchoice web site is showing my final talley for my annual bill for my medical coverage for 2006 and it's $4,368 . my maximum contribution amount is $3,750 . so there may be a mistake or that could in fact be my final premium for my 2006 expenses . got a feeling we're going to go through another round of error adjusting by ADP before we get our 2006 premium figured out .
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Elion ,
said i'd get back to ya when i got my figures together on my monthly premium for my Xerox retiree medical :
without the ' maximum contribution ' adjustment , it was $414.50 a month
with the $606 ' maximum contribution ' adjustment cranked in . it's now $364 a month .
by the way , my maximum contribution adjustment last year was $828 and my final monthly preminum was $297.41 a month . so i'm looking at a 22.237% increase in my monthly costs expect there may be additional adjustments by xerox before my final billing for 2006 in january from ADP , but i'm not counting on it . we should all get a final premium bill from ADP early next month . if my bill from ADP agrees with the numbers i see on my matterofchoice summerary screen , i'll pay that amount . once again to prevent billing errors / mix ups , i'll pay my full annual amount in one check in january and send it certified mail / return receipt . then i don't have to worry about weither ADP got the monthly premium or not .
and actually to get medical & dental for wife and I both , i'm very satisfied . most , if not ALL my friends who aren't xerox retirees , pay at least TWICE that amount and some pay almost THREE TIMES ( $1k + - a month ) for lessor coverage with ZERO choices .
p.s. for those who want to follow the original conversation , see our archives ( thank you :) xertech ) on / or about october 30th of this year .
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Thanks for the update...
If this rate of 20% increase every year stays, just a conservative estimate, I will be paying close to $900.00 per month before Medicare takes over in 5 years in my case.
I wonder how much are the active employees of Xerox Corp are paying now on their health insurance coverage?
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hi elion,
i spoke to some of my old buds and they said that they were pro-rated by salary.
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kilo & Elion ,
when i get back to my own branch office in january , i'll check with my guys and see what they're paying too .
i think their numbers might be lower because we ( retirees ) are in a seperate ' age ' class of our own . meaning we are lumped together with other retirees who tend to be less healthy as a group and use their healthcare benefits more . whereas active employees are lumped together with newer employees who do not use their healthcare very often . i know , myself , my wife and I didn't use our healthcare benefits very often for years when i was younger . xerox made that move a few years ago . Xerox justified that move because Federal regulations required them to do so and ARXE couldn't do much to get the company to do otherwise .
your calculation ahead like that is smart Elion . and who knows , if the Federal Goverment doesn't do anything to solve the healcare cost issue , your figure could be accurate . i also look at what my fellow retired friends pay and measure Xerox's offerings to us against that benchmark . so far , i think Xerox and what i pay is less than most of my friends .
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:D Do I ever feel lucky !! Took early in 1994 just as we started the flexable benafits. I pay nothing for me and my wife and Xerox even pays my provincal mediare premiums , I get hit only with a taxable benifit
BOB L
PS: I'm up here in Canada :D
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Congradulations BOB L ,
studies have shown that generally the sooner you receive a benefit , the better . at one point in time Xerox paid for 100% of retirees medical coverage . then it went to 80 / 20 fixed and then 80 / 20 flex and , of course , that went to what we see now where Xerox's share is pretty much fixed and our / your share gos up .
the future doesn't bode well for retirees as those who retire later will keep getting less than those in the past . and that's not just with Xerox , but most other corporations too .
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After contacting Xerox and asking if there was a parting gift for having worked for them, I received in the mail a few days later, an envelope with a paper at ah boy certificate. Also a selection of a gift form a merchandizing type cataloge[watches, clocks,glass ware,etc,and a gift certificate for 350 bucks. It will be hard keeping this from the wife's eyes. I wonder what sort of plans she would have for the money? So I better spend it now... Al..Clayt says if I make it up there, you will pop for eats at the Golden Fork. Is that ture? I do not know for sure if Xerox would have sent the above to me, without my asking. It is too bad a person has to ride shotgun to look out for what he has rightfully coming. Unfortunatally it is ture with just about anything. later--O
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hello big ' O ' ,
clayt.'s absolutely right that if you visit him here in Anchorage , Alaska and i'm in town , i'll spring for a buffet at our local Royal Fork . and i'll even go ya one better by offering you a free dinner in any town in Alaska you happen to catch me in when i'm on my summer real estate trips . i frequently travel to Faibanks , Homer , and points in between . clayt. showed me a place down on the Kenai where they offer all the fries you can eat .
course , you already realize that when you travel with Clayt. , that you've got to be prepared to pick up the entire bill yourself , unless you're with me .
wife and i picked a $325 gift certificate from J.C.Penny's when i retired in 2000 . she spent the last of it today . she got her money's worth carrying that thing around all these years . even spent some of it in hawaii on the big island before they closed that store over there .
and you're right about having to ' ride shotgun ' for yourself . but , hey , i never expected anything but a weekly paycheck out of xerox in the first place . sure was fun working for'em in the early days . sometimes i felt like i should pay them instead of the other way round . met alot of good people .
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well , i'm finally done cleaning up all the invalid and bad links in this topic . it's an interesting walk down memory lane going through all these posts .
would like to thank xertech for keeping these archives . there's quite a story here of the xerox history . for those interested , like Dwtn Don , might consider copying these for the ' record ' .
now i can get back to my work of finding new news of interest to retirees .
p.s. if any of ya happen accross a post with a ' invalid ' link , let me know . give me a post date so i can clean it up too .
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just received a personal message from Xertechadmin :
" Hey Allan ,
Thanks for all the help , i hope this board will last a few years ..... :-D
Eric "
as is my custom , i like to respond to personal emails on one of my ' Retiree News ' forums :
" my privilege Eric . i know with your effort , it will not only last , but prosper . "
allancoleman
admin team
actually communicating with xeroids here reminds me of all the great people i met and worked with all those years with Xerox . priceless . 8-)
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Hello all,just found this site today,kudos to all involved.while I am not a xerox retiree,i did spend many years in the trenches of los angeles and woodland hills as a Xeroid,laid of in the first rif,i believe i have several years vested in the xerox pension plan and I am wondering if any body can give me a contact name,email or phone number of someone within Xerox for me too find out whats up with my pension?any help would be greatly appreciated,thanks Kevin Thompson former Xerox rep in cali.
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welcome lvkopykat ,
i came close to getting laid off myself a couple of times while xerox was down sizing from over 100k employees to their present levels . welcome to our merry band and if there's anything i , or our admin staff , can do to make your visits here more enjoyable , please let us know . feel free to respond or start any topics of your own here . see ya on the next service call maybe . :-)
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lvkopykat,
Call the Xerox Benifit Center at: 1-888-979-9961
(To reach a representative, say or enter your Social Security Number, and then say representative)
Or use the website: http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox/
Should be no problem contacting them. If have not touch your Cash Balance or Transitional Account AKA Xerox Retirement Plan you can do a transfer to your Xerox 401K. I still most of my money at the Xerox 401K. You have other options in your retirement money, a pension or an annuity is just one of them.
Let us know if you need help.
Elion
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hello again lvkopykat ,
sorry i didn't respond to your complete question in your first post . i couldn't see your entire message on my screen . Elion is correct with his reference to the Xerox / Hewitt web site and phone number for information on any pension you may have left with Xerox . a quick phone call should give you all the facts .
thanks Elion for covering up for me . :?
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Lvkopykat ,
in addition to calling the above phone number that Elion gave you , please call and check to see if there is any money left from the RIGP Lawsuit Settlement at : 1 - 888 - 435 - 6192 . if you want to get a backround on what was happening at that time frame , please check our archives ( thank you :-) xertech ) for the posts starting from March 02 , 2004 11:52:19 a.m. going forward a few weeks .
for those others reading here , i will send lvkopykat a personal message informing him of this post .
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I just added a " Retiree " section to the Xerox-Service.com Wiki.
Feel free to add any info that you wish.Just click on "edit".
I have put some resources there already.
Here's the link (http://www.xerox-service.com/wiki/index.php/Retirement_Resources)
Any feedback is appreciated as well.
Don
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thanks Don for your above link . and i encourage all of our Xertech members and guests to visit your site and especially your above link . the more input we and you have on our sites for retirees , the easier and better retirement will be for us xeroids . we certainly earned that over our careers . :-)
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just received a email from A.R.X.E. regarding the ' OLD PLAN ' issue of Xerox changing their Medicare reimbursement rate . apparently Xerox only received 100 letters of protest out of a possibile 7,000 participants of that plan . and that's about the number of Old Plan members ARXE has . so this might be a matter of ' too little , too late ' , and another reason why it's so important if you're a Xerox retiree to join ARXE .
for more details , please check out their web site at :
http://www.arxe.org
you can join on line .
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Hi Allen,
did you notice that ARXE got a nastygram from corporate? how dare us.
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yeah Kilo ,
actually i can't get excited over the fact that Xerox is going to freeze the Medicare part A & B payment that the rest of us retirees have always had to pay . and actually corporate is just freezing their portion of the payment and the old plan retirees are just responsible for the increases in the future . but i'll let ARXE handle this dispute and hope that this battle that it looks like ARXE is gong to lose will give Xerox seconds thoughts about other retiree benefit cuts .
i think the bigger issue here is the fact that we only have several thousand members of ARXE when there are many tens of thousands of Xerox retirees who don't want to add their voice to the struggle to maintain what we presently have in retiree benefits . personally i'm very happy with my present Xerox retiree benefit package , but also realize if we don't join and support organizations like ARXE , we could lose what we have .
appreciate your reply / input here and hope it encourages others .
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Howdy Al--finally got logged onto the new version of the xertech site. I lost my old password/user, so instead of the big O, it is now minnO. Any how, just want to let you know that I will be up to see Clayt April 27 for a few days, and leaving with him for the trip down south. I do not know weather you will be around before the milk crazed one {clayt] heads south to sponge of the relativies or not. But I would like to see this person --you--that Clayt is always talking about. I know it is my money, but am splurging for a plane ticket up to see the bearded one. Do you think it is a waste of good hard earned money to visit him? later--minnO
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hello big ' O ' ,
yes i do feel it'a a terrible waste of your retirement money to visit the bearded one in Alaska . he isn't a true friend . will mouch off ya when ever you go out to eat and all he does is complain about the ' not cold enough ' milk all the time . but you already knew that . :-) .
won't be in Alaska in April at all , am in Kailua-Kona surfing every morning and calling Clayt. every moring and talking stock market stuff . maybe your next trip . take plenty cash with ya on your trip with Clayt. big ' O ' cause he has a way of not paying for anything . heck , he'll probably figure out a way to stiff ya to pay for the gas in his own vehicle while you're riding with ' em . all of us have different crosses to bear in our lives and we know which cross that one is for us two .
you'll enjoy the scenery and the Kenai and Clayt.'s fishing holes are really pretty this time of year up there . thanks for keeping in touch . i'm be feeling your pain thinking about ya being with ' em . :-)
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received an email overnite from the Association of Retired Xerox Employees regarding my membership renewal . it's the same $10 annual fee and the mailing address for that is :
Association of Retired Xerox Employees
P.O. Box 477
Fairport , New York 14450
this is my 60 day notice and for more details on joining A.R.X.E. , you can do so on their web site at :
http://www.arxe.org
as Kilo says in the post after this one , it's money well spent . waiting to join AFTER they cut our retiree benefit package is TOO late .
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anyone who is retired or planning to should join even if they never read the newsletter it's money well spent
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well kilo , not only is membership in A.R.X.E. money well spent , but i just received a email from ARXE that says Xerox is " rescinding the Old Plan Medicare Part B cap " because of the write in campaign that ARXE started . ARXE asks that members of the Old Plan sent a letter or email to Anne thanking her for her actions .
for more details , please check out ARXE's web site at : http://www.arxe.org
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received email confirmation of A.R.X.E. getting my check for my membership renewal .
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Howdy Al--Got an e-mail from the milkman [clayt]. He wants me to mention, that he will be taking me to a spot where the french fries are the main course. I understand you will be in Hawaii when I fly up. It would have been nice to meet you. I will have to get your e-mail or phone # when you get back up there, as I do have a few questions on Roth's and taxes. Nothing pressing right now. I am kicking myself a tad for not being more into the market, as times have been good the past few weeks. later--minnO
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hello big ' O ' ,
there is a nice place to eat on the Kenai where you get all the fries you can eat . and although they provided me with a huge helping to go along with my just as big hamburger , i ordered a second helping of fries , which they provided as promised . Clayt. knows everybody on the Kenai as he spends most of his summer there fishing on the river . on the other hand , i spend most of my summers in Alaska working on my various properties in Fairbanks , North Pole , and Homer , Alaska . so i don't spend as much time at those one or two places that Clayt. enjoys .
as for your Roth questions , feel free to ask them here if you wish . i answer quite a few Roth questions on Suite101 too for others . and for those of ya who are interested in Roth conversions you might check out Suite101's Roth forum at : ( http://investment.suite101.com/discussion.cfm/66 ) . i post there under the same handle i use here . i've done quite a few Roth conversions in the past and expect to do quite a few more in the future before i'm 70 1/2 , at which time because of RMD means it's more difficult to pay the taxes necessary in a Roth conversion .
Roth conversions are really for those who expect to be in a higher tax bracket in retirement than they were when they worked . in short , if you want a brief idea why some people do Roth conversions , divide 27.4 into your guesstimated deferred accounts total at age 70 1/2 , and that's the first RMD ( required minimum distribution ) the government will expect you to withdraw from your deferred accounts beginning at age 70 1/2 . and if that required distribution upsets you then you might want to consider Roth conversions now rather than wait . in my particular circumstance , i have an excessive ( it's a nice problem to have :-) ) amount in my deferred accounts and if i don't do Roth conversions , i'll be in the highest tax bracket forever after age 70 1/2 because of RMD .
you'll enjoy your trip and alittle trip report here after you return might be appreciated by those other xeroids considering a similar trip to Alaska . keep in touch .
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i have to envy you guys that move into a HIGHER bracket, won' be a problem here, but we should have enough for a florida place, condo in massachusetts (grandchildren) and a small sailboat, even a night out once in a while.
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it is a nice problem kilo having too much money and having to come up with a strategy like Roth conversions to solve my higher than i would like required minium distributions later at age 70 1/2 . but we're all going to be in that boat at age 70 1/2 . i'm just bringing up the point now cauise it's alot easier doing Roth conversions BEFORE you're required to take RMD later at age 70 1/2 AND attempt to do Roth conversions too in the same tax year .
and in the end , if one has enough money to be able to afford the life style of their choice AND maintain their health , then the rest of the money really isn't necessary .
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Plan on being in Waikolo Village (and KONA) April 8 to 15 give me a phone # and will buy you a beer if we can arange it
BOB L
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hello BOB L ,
sorry to tell ya but i'm going to be on the Hilo ( windward ) side durning the heart of that week staying at the Hilo Seaside hotel and working on my lots in Puna . while you're on the Big Island , rent a car , if you don't have one , and drive to Volcano National Park and see the film at the Visitors Center . it's free and it's always different . even frequent local visitors stop there and view the quick 20 minute film to get the latest updates and see what the lava is doing . this National Park unlike more and more others is still available for vehicular traffic so you can drive anywhere you want in the park and don't have to board busses to view the sights . i suspect at some point in the future you will not be able to drive anywhere you want in the park so enjoy it while you can .
leave Waikoloa early in the morning in order to drive through Kailua-Kona to arrive at the Park early enough to see the film and drive down to the water to possibily hike to see the lava pour into the ocean . it'll take you a several hour drive to get there . ensure you leave the Park early enough to arrive back on the Kohala sun coast shortly after sundown . darkness in the tropics comes earlier than it does at higher latitudes like Canada or Alaska . expect cool wet weather in the Park so bring a jacket with ya because you're at higher elevations than you are at sea level on the coast . and bring a water container with ya in case you decide to hike over the lava fields to see the red hot lava pour into the ocean . you can get more details and directions at the Visitors Center .
also a quicker drive through Waimea to the Waipi'o Valley overlook is well worth another day . and a drive through Hawi to see the Pololu' Valley overlook would be another nice short trip . take your camera and bring plenty of film .
it's been pretty rainy here lately but you're visiting one of the driest places in all of Hawaii , so if it's wet where you're at , it's probably pouring everywhere else . if you do get to Kona while i'm gone , stop by White Sands beach on Ali'i drive and see where i surf every morning i'm in Kona . i'm usually always there between 7:30 a.m. and 9:30 a.m. in the morning when i'm in town . it's also called Disappearing Sands beach , Magic , and La'aloa . the very next beach on Ali'i drive is Kahalu' beach park where you can see numberous honu ( turtles ) feeding on seaweed .
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just received a email from A.R.X.E. putting out the word on a special membership drive :
anyone applying for a membership starting April 1st , 2006 , through March 31st , 2007 will be given an additional 12 months added to the enrollment period .
this is your chance to join for peanuts . :-) . sign up online at : http://www.arxe.org
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Just want to let the person who designed and put together this new Xertech web site, that it is awesome. I like the foremat, its like no other I have seen. I was not real happy with the previous one, alot of pop ups and advertising to scroll thru. Keep up the good work. And who knows, mabey Al will share his secrets on dealing with rain. You know Al, that the last few days in April, it will be very nice in Anchorage, I am even dreaming that the Bearded one will be buying lunch. later--minnO
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hello big ' O ' ,
the absence of advertising and pop - ups is different . funny , but i've learned to ignore or look past most of those things after all my surfing on the rest of the web . it really wasn't that bad to me .
your weather should be pretty good on your trip on the Kenai penisula with Clayt. and your trip back down the Alcan back to the lower 48 will be unforgetable . done that trip a few times and it's really a ' kick ' . take your camera and plenty of film .
and don't forget to take plenty of money cause the bearded one will be without when it comes time to pay for anything . :-)
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thought i might warn you BOB L on your trip to Hawaii next week to stay away from the beaches around Waikiki . they have been receiving record rains on Oahu and dumped milliions of gallions of sewage that will take awhile to clean up . beaches here on the big island are fine . i'll be leaving for the windward side , Hilo , next week .
have a nice trip . :-)
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thought i might warn you BOB L on your trip to Hawaii next week to stay away from the beaches around Waikiki . they have been receiving record rains on Oahu and dumped milliions of gallions of sewage that will take awhile to clean up . beaches here on the big island are fine . i'll be leaving for the windward side , Hilo , next week .
have a nice trip . :-)
Thanks for the heads up but I won't be stopping there as I have a direct flight to Kona
BOB L
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good . all of my flights are through Honolulu and we used to stop over a day or so in Honolulu on the way from Alaska or back to Alaska and spend the day messing around Waikiki . but now isn't the time to do that and visit Waikiki between flights .
our weather has been fairly cloudy the last few weeks . by the time you get here next week , our usual Kohala Coast sunshine should be back again . it's been fairly wet in Hilo . but that's usual for windward weather .
been surfing here in Kona most every day under cloudy skies . Oahu , Maui , and Kauai have really been catching the rain lately .
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decided to remove / delete the last of the two polls and topics i started :
the first was on our temporary dark backround look to our web site . that ballot as 13 total votes cast with 7 ( 53.8% ) for a lighter backround preference , 5 ( 38.5% ) for a darker backround , and one ( 7.7% ) for didn't care .
the second topic and poll was about our web site advertising . a total of 5 ballots were cast with 3 votes for advertising and pop - ups o.k. , and 2 ( 40% ) ballots didn't care .
neither poll was probably enough votes to make much of a difference with our powers that be . :-)
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Hi Allen, i think most of us are just happy to have this site, i'll take whatever to keep it on line
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agree with ya 100% kilo . just thought i'd run a couple of polls to measure our membership opinion .
what's your opinion of Toner's upcoming decision on weither to go with Xerox's " accelerated benefits " option for his health care costs . ? ?
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Allan,
Jut my two cents but I wouldn't touch the Accelerated Benefits option with a ten foot pole...If you do, you forfeit whatever benefit you might have forthcoming after you reach the rapidly approaching age of 65.....You can bet your bottom dollar that "Uncle Sugar" ain't gonna' cover you to your satisfaction and then you're left hanging in the wind and hoping you stay healthy or die quickly...
I still have a couple of years to go before I reach 65 but I declined the Accelerated Benefits option immediately when it was offered...The retiree medical plan is expensive enough without tossing everything out the window when you reach 65 and hoping the good old government of the USofA will look out for you..Without some type of additional benefit you can get in big trouble depending on Medicare alone....My mom is a good example of that...She pays almost $400 per month for her supplemental insurance benefit...Thank goodness she is in a position that is not a burden for her but for a lot of people it would really hurt..
Life is good and retirement is great here in Florida....Golf at least three days a week and paddling our kayaks at least once a week...
Kilo, we're still keeping the guest room open for you...
Boatbum
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really appreciate your post boatbum . and i hope Toner is listening . i totally agree with your decision and it was exactly the same one i made for myself for the very same reasons . but being one of the moderators / administrators of this web site and the originator of this forum , i can only go so far in offering advice . just as the commentary of the Chairman of A.R.X.E. , he only could offer the advice to seriously look at the longer term effects of the decision for one's self . and consider that the short term savings may not be entirely wise over the long term . and , of course , there's always the outside chance that mother X will go out of business and leave us all without any future coverage anyway . but , i'm willing to take that risk .
your life style in Florida sounds much like my ' snow bird ' life style of being between Hawaii where i surf every morning in the winter and Alaska where i RV and hike and camp out in my Volkswagen Eurovan poptop camper all summer . and all the while walking 8 to 10 miles a day while the wife bikes over 10 miles a day plus swims here in Kona . as you say , retirement is good . and i hope to assist others in achieving the same wonderful results in their retirement .
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just received a email from A.R.X.E. in regards to their Shareholder Proposal 2006 for the Xerox Annual Meeting to be held May 24th . this is about the Senior Executive Bonuses .
for further detail , please check our web site : http://www.arxe.org
p.s. for those not aware , ARXE has a membership drive going on right now where you can receive a 24 month period membership for just one year's fee . you can join online . remember , AFTER our retiree benefits are gone will be too late .
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A.R.X.E. , Association of Retired Xerox Employees , announces their 2006 Annual Meeting will be held June 8th in Rochester , New York . they report that almost half of their membership is from the upstate New York region . i'm sure there will be further announcements as to the time and location . check further details at : http://www.arxe.org
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hi boatbum,
sorry for the late comeback, we've got a wedding coming up 4/29 in san juan. couldn't get to fl this year, but if the folks are up for it the wife and i might take a leave and go down for a couple of months next year, by the way, i'm with you on the insurance issue, my father-in-law had to buy supplemental bc/bs and it cost him a bunch, we lucked out and were able top get him in under his wifes' county retirement plan.
bought a new boat, balboa 20', kinda small but i think we're gonna try some lake sailing.
kilo
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Kilo,
I did quite a bit of sailing on a friend's Balboa 26....He trailered it all over the west coast and even down to the Sea of Cortez and sailed with the "big boys" wherever he went...The only complaint I had with it was the lack of standing headroom unless the top was popped and even then it was marginal....I bashed my head more than once on it...He singlehanded it most of the time and a 60 mile sail from Ventura down to Catalina Island was a regular thing for him..
We still haven't jumped back into the role of "boat owner" but we have enough friends and acquaintenances that own boats that we just enjoy the chance to be "crew" for them....We do enjoy our kayaks and will be paddling the Ichetucknee River this weekend with my wife's brother...
Stay in touch and let us know when you head this way..
Boatbum
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IMPORTANT IMPORTANT IMPORTANT IMPORTANT
in conjunction with Eric opening up four new forums for Minolta , Toshiba , Ricoh , and Canon , i'd like to also extend a welcome for any of those techs or retirees to feel more than welcome to take part on our " Retiree News " forum , or any of our other topics here on this forum . have never spoken to any poster here about being " off topic " and don't intend to start . feel the flow of communication is much more important than weither you " on topic " or not . or feel free to start a forum / topic of your own chosing here .
allancoleman
Admin team
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as a member of A.R.X.E. , i just received a email to attend the ARXE 2006 Annual Meeting on June 8th to be held at the County Party House located at 321 East Linden Avenue in East Rochester , N.Y.
ARXE is requesing a signed proxy and will not accept email transmission and is asking members to print it out on their printer and mail them in to the address provided . for more details , please visit our site at : http://www.arxe.org
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just received a email with a " clarification " of why A.R.X.E. requires a hard copy signed proxy for their upcoming annual meeting . some thing to do with New York state law regarding non profit corporations , as ARXE is now . for more details , members should check with the ARXE web site at : ( http://www.arxe.org ) .
ARXE has also set up a special email address , Annual_Meeting_Questions@arxe.org , for those to ask questions to be addressed at the annual meeting . ARXE requested that members use this special email address for questions to be answered at their annual meeting INSTEAD of using their regular email address on their site . enjoy
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i just arrived back last nite from Hawaii , in my mail box was my proxy vote for my Xerox shares i still hold in my personal brokerage account and i personally voted for A.R.X.E.'s proposal against excessive performance bonuses for CEOs . not sure how my few , little over a thousand shares , is going to effect Xerox , but i cast my vote along with ARXE .
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for those of you weather buffs , there is snow here on the ground in Anchorage , Alaska . not enough to last through the day or stick on the roads , but it's here on the ground and lawns and vehicles and wind shields . i'll leave for Fairbanks , Alaska next week and am sure i'll run into snow in the passes on the way . looks like a late spring here . :-) and to think i was surfing in Hawaii last week . :?
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stopped by local Xerox office this morning to find out everybody is awaiting word on the next IRIF / VRIF coming down maybe later today . most on the few contractors figure they're already history :cry: . and some of the tech reps may walk too . looks like KT was right .
i'll post more later here as i find it out .
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would like to remind my readership that Eric has thoughtfully provided us with a " Member Map " on the top tool bar . it's pretty neat to see what towns and countries our various members reside . if you actually type in your town's name in the proper slot , when you put your cursor on a green dot , you get the member's handle and what town he's from . i see we also are building an overseas following .
appreciate Eric's work and thanks to those for letting us know who and where you are . kind of keeps our Xertech family closer i think . :-)
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Howdy Al--Make the trip up to visit Clayt and Cindy. They treated me like royality, well, at least Cindy did. Took Clatys fifth wheeler down to the spot where he keeps it for summer fishing. BOY what scenery, one oooh and aaah after another. Turnagain arm was especially interesting with the ever changing weather. Had great weather for 11 straight days, what more could one ask for. Clayt and I really enjoyed making the trip down together. It was a trade off--1 garage sale for every secenic stop for pictures. I know I got the better of that deal. Laughed and talked a ton, but ate tooooo much.. Not enough walking for me, but been doing my miles since I got home. I can honestly say, it was a trip of a life time for me. later -- bigO
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hello big ' O ' ,
sounds like your trip was good . now you can see the beautiful scenery we have to live with up here . and you're right about Cindy . sometimes when i call Clayt. and get Cindy instead , it's a better conversation then i usually have with the bearded one . glad you were able to see where i spend most of my spring , summers , and fall .
i leave for Fairbanks next week and then turn around and head for Homer on the Kenai the first part of next month .
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just received a email from A.R.X.E. in regards to their executive bonus proposal at Xerox's annual meeting . it was a " Good News , Bad News " type of message . 78.9 million shares of the total outstanding shares voted for our proposal ( good news ) , but that was only 8.6% of the total outstanding shares ( bad news ) . apparently A.R.X.E. got to talk to alot of Xerox people at the annual meeting and Anne actually spoke in behalf of the retirees in her statement to the public .
so , all in all , not terribly bad for our side . more details at ARXE's web site at : http://www.arxe.org
they still have a enrollment special going on that's a two years for the price of one year's subscription price ( $10.00 ) .
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just renewed at $10/yr.................still a bargain
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especially when you consider they ( ARXE ) are talking to corporate Xerox on probably a daily basis . or certainly if an issue comes up long before we ever hear about it . all we read / hear about are the larger issues brought before the public , but i'm sure all the ARXE vips have the corporate Xerox vips special telephone numbers on their speed dial . and it is nice to know someone besides little ole me is on my side in any specific issue regarding my retiree benefits . :-)
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REMINDER
June 3oth is the deadline for the 2005 claim submission under the Medical , Dental , and Vision plans and the Health Care and Dependent Care Salary Redirection Accounts . for those of you with money still left in your Xerox 401(k) account , see more details at that web site at :
http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox
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on the matterofchoice web site :
http://www.matterofchoice.com
there is a new message screen that says that 90 days prior to turning 65 , a Personal Benefits Representative will call Xerox retirees to walk you / us through any questions we may have regarding transition to benefits available to us after 65 . this is much needed as it is difficult to figure out all the different options available to us when we transition to 65 . and some of the decisions we make at this time CANNOT be reversed and done over again if we find out later that we made the wrong choice .
there is also a transition to 65 FAQ section on ARXE's web site at :
http://www.arxe.org
for those with membership over there .
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just received a email today from A.R.X.E. that the " Open Enrollment Guides " for 2006 were available for all three plans on their web site . this is the Flex , New , and Old plans in pdf. file format . so if any of ya lost yours , check : ( http://www.arxe.org )
they also report that their enrollment numbers are DROPPING . NOT good for an outfit fighting for our retiree benefits . they are the only group i know doing so . they still have their " Two for One " special where if you pay for the first year at the regular $10 dues fee , you get the second additional year FREE . what a deal . if we don't help this group help us , it could be a long lonely battle later . :|
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there is a new " Question of the Month " on the matterofchoice web site : ( http://www.matterofchoice.com ) .
Xerox has created a new " Retiree Outreach Program " . a " Personal Benefits Representative " will call you 90 DAYS prior to your 65th birthday to answer your questions regarding your transition from " Pre - 65 " to " Post - 65 " benefits . this is neat and for those who aren't close to that date / time frame yet , ARXE has an excellent " FAQs " section too that answers alot of these same questions . by the way , this " FAQs " tab is a growing data base that members should periodicly check back to update themselves . another good reason to join ARXE . :-)
p.s. and , by the way , if you aren't used to logging in to the matterofchoice web site , there is a link on the log - in page that allows you to access certains sections of the site without logging in . check it out . Xerox is trying to assist you / us to transition from employment to retirement and then to medicare and beyond . use it . :-)
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just received a personal email from Ray Cote that was mis - directed to our Administrator , Eric . because of the redirection from Eric to me , it wasn't possible for me to directly respond back to Ray . so i'll ask Ray to sent me another personal email if he wants .
basicly , Ray has left Xerox now . worked in the New York city area and agreed with me that the old Xerox was great . Ray still works on Xerox gear with other ex - Xeroids . as for myself , work was a four letter word and i'm very fortunate that my investment decisions more than support me in the life style of my choice without working . :-)
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i've always felt that a company match (at least the first 5%) to the 401k was the way to go, but even with that incentive some people would rather have that new convertable.
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another way to go in all of this pension news is to take your lumpsum money with ya so you don't have to be worried / concerned about the company NOT being there later with your pension check . make your own pension plan and write your own checks . :-D
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just received a personal email message from one of our registered members , " NYCTech " . and as is my custom , i usually mention personal emails received in one of my forums . his god given name is Ray Cote and he owns and runs the Village Copier Service LLC in New York city . lists his mailing address as the ' Bronx ' and says all of his customers are " time and materials " so he can pretty much choose to work on what he wants to . thought i'd give him a plug here if any of ya are looking for service or a good cup of coffee if you're in the neighborhood . look'em up and share Xeroid & Xertech war stories . :-)
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now that the president has signed the new pension law , we've had alittle time to digest the results and here's one of the articles i've found that speaks to the future of pensions :
http://www.moneyandmarkets.com/press.asp?rls_id=389&cat_id=6
and it's bad enough when they use " B " as in billions when they talk about the $28 billion dollars that the PBGC is in the hole covering pensions already gone bankrupt , but when they begin to mention " T " as in trillions to describe the $1.5 trillion dollar combined pensions and benefits in trouble , it boggles the mind .  :?
remember , if in doult , take the lump sum and manage it yourself and write yourself your own pension check however often you need it . a 4% to 5% withdrawal rate almost guarantees that you'll never run out of money . and even larger withdrawal rates of 6% to 7% will take many , many , many years to deplete before it runs out . and if you're even marginally good or lucky at investing , it could last forever even at those higher withdrawal rates .
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the Lunp Sum Interest Rate for 2007 has been released by the IRS . it is the 30 year Treasury yield of 5% . this rate is used in our RIGP calculation . the LOWER the rate , the HIGHER the lump sum amount . the HIGHER the rate , the LOWER the lump sum amount . for more information , go to our Benefits web site : ( http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox/ ) or call Xerox for your individual projection .
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Went to my local Social Security office this morning to put in my application for my Social Security check . My birthday is November 26th and the office said for Social Security purposes i won't be 62 until December , therefore i'll receive my first check in January of 2007 . I thought i'd be able to complete my application on my first trip this morning , but i was asked to make an appointment for another date to finish my paperwork and i picked tomorrow morning so i'll return again tomorrow .
Expect to receive over $1,400 a month and i should get more information on that tomorrow . I'll also request Medicare plan part ' A ' and ' B ' as Xerox requests their retirees for that selection option for Xerox retiree healthcare coverage .
Will post additional information tomorrow . Stay tuned .
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The Open Enrollment period for 2007 opens on the Matterofchoice web site ( http://www.matterofchoice.com ) on October 30th and extends until Friday , November 17th . There are NO prices yet on that site , but there are your health care plan options available to you for next year .
Enjoy
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Hi Allen,
Welcome to the social security system, glad to see that another working stiff made it to the promised land. I don't remember having to do the Medicare forms, but that was a year and a half ago.
Live long and prosper!
Kilo
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Thanks Kilo ,
My check amount will be $1,430.00 a month . I delayed the deposit of my first check until February because i didn't want to show any Social Security income for tax year 2006 . There isn't any specific designation for Medicare Part ' A ' and ' B ' now because the default is for you / us is to automaticly receive and pay for part ' B ' when you / we / us turn 65 . Part ' A ' is free for most of us . If you don't want to pay for Part ' B ' , you'll have to cancel it later . Xerox wants us to sign up for and pay for Medicare Part ' B ' if we want to take advantage of their retiree healthcare coverage .
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Hi Allen,
I know that you are aware that you can have taxes witheld, and that you are too smart to do that. I started collecting last october then got a raise in january, WHAT A COUNTRY! then i got downsized from my part-time/contract job and am now collecting unemployment and ss, WHAT A COUNTRY!
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Yes , kilo , I was aware that i could have taxes deducted from my Social Security check if i wanted . I'm so used to paying quarterly checks now that i elected to NOT have anything taken out and i'll continue to monitor my income through out the calendar year . I usually pay almost all of my annual taxes owed in my first THREE quarterly checks because often i don't return from Hawaii in time to make my last quasrterly check that's due January 15th .
You're right about this being a great country . I found my military time served added an additional $8 bucks or so to my monthly check . And when you multiply that times 12 months a year times how many years i'll probably collect my Social Security check , it's worth while to take down your DD - 214 paperwork for them to calculate your monthly check if you're a vet . :-)
Waiting for my Open Enrollment for 2007 book to show up in my snail mail box any time now . It's my favorite time of year .
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thanks for the heads up, i've fogotten if i had to show my dd-214, maybe i'll wear my american legion uniform down there.....8 bucks buys a lot of beans
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Not sure they'll recalculate your Social Security check amount , but it's worth going down to see . Keep in mind , kilo , that Social Security wants to see Original Documents . They will take your original document , make a copy of it and return your original to you . I'm sure there must be some way they can access your military records to verify the information too . I took ALL my miilitary records down with me including my Honorable Discharge papers . But , the only thing they asked for was my DD - 214 form . Any service for a period of less than 90 DAYS will NOT count . And there are different credits for different periods served .
Good luck
P.S. I was wearing my ' Vietnam Veteran ' baseball cap . Maybe that helped . :roll:
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Hi Al---The big O here--I see you will be leaving for warmer weather soon, well nothing wrong with that. I also plan on spending a bit of time in Arizona this winter. Got a preview of the medical via snail mail. Sounds like a fairly good jump in costs to us. But the good thing, it is still offered. My only mistake this year, was not to be in on the big run up in the stocks this fall. Mabey a bigger mistake than I think. Hopefully it will stumble, and I will have an opportunity to participate. The gtifted/bearded one, keeps preaching the virtues of ginny maes. For my self, I find it extreeeemly hard to venture away from what I currently have going. Mabey I am way to conservitive, or I am listening to my wife way tooooo much. Enjoy the Islands, and make a bunch of dough. later--big O
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Actually big ' O ' , I'm here in Hawaii right now . Arrived in Kona this last Saturday on " Iron Man " day . Had alittle damage from the quake , but alot less than some even just right down the hall .
I'm out of this rally too , but I'm not going to buy in at these levels . Purchased $101k worth of GNMAs at $9.93 a share nav . Price is $10.13 as of market close this evening . So I'm making over 5% interest plus nav appreciation too . Figure I'm ahead about 8% ytd and I just bought them June 22nd . Hope to buy more in the next couple of weeks closer to $10.00 a share .
Things good on my end . Clayton and I talk about ya everytime we're on the phone .
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Just received an email message from our Association of Retired Xerox Employees organization that Xerox is going to change their beneficiary rules in their 401(k) . It has to do with " The ability of non - spousal beneficiaries to roll - over qualified plan monies directly to an IRA " . Before any spouses or non - spouses get excited at Xerox for these changes , this is an IRS regulation change to take effect January 1st of next year . Xerox is just informing us of their compliance with the law . Members please check our web site : http://www.arxe.org for further details .
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Our Association of Retired Xerox Employees has a message to invite new members in the Dallas - Fort Worth area for that local chapter at ZIP Codes of 75xxx and 76xxx . They are also going to open a local chapter in the Sarasota , Florida area . And Los Angles , Claifornia at ZIP Codes of 90xxx , 91xxx , and 92xxx .
Go to our web site at : http://www.arxe.org to get more details . They need a minimum of some many people in order to open a local chapter . We are also still in a membership drive where if you pay for one year's dues , you get a second year FREE . Not bad for $10 bucks
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Just received a couple of personal emails from ' NYCTech ' . In addition to sharing the fact we were both born in Brooklyn during World War II , he asked my advice about how to price a FSMA on one of his accounts . Possibily one of you tecs more current with the expense of keeping one of these things running now a days could give him an idea . ? ?
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Hey Allan,
Todays trading in my virtual portfolio.. Xerox is going UP >:
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Noticed that too , Eric . As you well know , the last quarter of the year is usually Xerox's best because they pull out all the stops and try to cram in as many installs as possible durning this period of time . End of month , end of quarter , end of year . It was a nightmare installing that gear right up to the final day and watching all the " paper " installs for gear that didn't arrive on time . :-) . Plus they usually stop all expenses such as travel , etc . My research shows the best month to sell Xerox stock by far is January just before Xerox reports earnings toward the end of January - remember that ole stock market advice of " buy on the rumer , sell on the news " . So I figure the price of Xerox stock will drop when Xerox reports what the market figured what Xerox was going to report anyway . That's why the price of Xerox stock is UP now because there are more buyers than sellers . When there's more sellers than buyers , prices drop . I intend to sell ALL my Xerox common shares in January of 2008 because of the ZERO capital gains in the 15% tax bracket for that tax year . I converted all my ESOP shares to common shares at a cost basis of $13.05 a share and paid taxes on them for that amount when I terminated in 2000 and have held them in my Schwab brokerage account ever since .
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The Association of Retired Xerox Employees has a NEW forum on their web site ( http://www.arxe.org ) called the " Discussion Forum " where you can ask questions and get answers and generally communicate with other ARXE members just as we do here on Xertech . Check it out . They still have their membership drive special where you pay for one year at the normal fee of $10 and get another year membership FREE . Two years for the price of one . :-)
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Just received a personal message from one of our founding members and a great contributor to our messages boards , KT135 . And , as is my habit , I usually share my emails with our membership on one of my forums . KT asked me if I had Eric's mailing address . KT wanted Eric's mailing address cause he'd probably like to send him a donation . I told KT that I did not have Eric's mailing address . Also told KT that if Eric didn't make it easier for some us folks to send him cash or a check that Eric would have to learn how to pay for this web page without my money . :?
By the way , the " Discussion Forum " on ARXE's web site is going great guns . Already posted several times myself over there . :-)
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Just received another email message from our Association of Retired Xerox Employees that their new " Discussion Forum " is a real hit . I would have to agree . Lots of back and forth about all Xerox issues . For those interested , ARXE still has a membership drive going on . $10 a year is a heck of a deal . Only deal I know is better is here at Xertech where it's free . :-)
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Just received another email message from OUR Association of Retired Xerox Employees at ( http://www.arxe.org ) warning us of a SECURITY ALERT from ADP & Xerox Benefits about a seperate company calling Xerox employees for individual personal information . Be Careful giving out your personal data .
Keep in mind that ARXE still has a membership special going on and you get TWO for one by joining ARXE now . $10 bucks a year is one heck of a deal . Help support ARXE while we still have benefits to protect .
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IMPORTANT ------ IMPORTANT ----- IMPORTANT ----- IMPORTANT ---- IMPORTANT
Would like to issue a personal " WELCOME " to our latest member , " ARXE Chairman " , David Coriale , who is the Chairman of our ARXE . I've invited him to post here any place he desires or feel free to start his own forum or topic here on Xertech .
Any of you who have questions of David can sent him a personal email through Xertech or post on David's forum / topic if he decides to start one here on Xertech or he may decide to post on one my Retiree News forum topics . And , of course , you can always contact David by joining ARXE online too .
p.s. Eric , David has some personal questions of you about our Xertech software that only you can better answer . Hopefully you guys will get together and chat .
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Just came from our ARXE web site where I posted a reply to our chairman , David Coriale's reply to my question IF Xerox might not offer retiree healthcare in the future . His reply gave me hope . Really suggest those of you who qualify to join , do so , and read our new discussion forums over there .
Wish all of ya a safe and happy holiday season .
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ARXE is putting out the word for residents of Florida interested in forming a local chapter to get ahold of MNJWalker@comcast.net
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I recently had the occassion to call our Xerox benefits number at : 1 - 888 - 979 - 9961 to verify a important benefit for our spouses . As Xerox policy is set up now , in the event of the Xerox retiree's death , the surviving spouse is offered the Xerox retiree healh benefit jusr as if the surviving spouse was a Xerox retiree . A important benefit to our spouses , of course .
In the course of the phone conversation , I also learned that Hewitt still handles benefit questions for current Xerox employees and ADP now handles benefit questions for Xerox retirees and Union personal . My own personal experience with BOTH has been excellent .
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First meeting of the local ARXE Florida chapter is being held at the Spanish Point Heritage Center in Osprey on March 16th . Please check our web site ( http://www.arxe.org ) for further details .
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Received from Xerox Corp information that they anticipate major changes in our 401(k) coming later this summer . Will report those changes when I get them in the mail later . Stay tuned .
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The bi - monthly May - June issue of the West Coast Xerox retiree club's newsletter is available on their web site : http://www.xrwc.org
It's a short three page issue . I will remove all reference from our archives ( thank you :-) Xertech ) to this newsletter and retiree club because they archive all their newsletters on their own site . This site is free to the public with no passwords required to access the entire site . This Xerox retiree club will accept membership applications from anywhere in the country . It's a good choice for those on the ' left ' coast . Enjoy
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Hi Al--It has been a while since I posted anything on this site. In fact the Bearded One has come and returned home and still no post from me. He borrowed Sy Hardings book for me to read while he was here. The one you wrote in. It was certainly a good read, and I sort of have been doing something like that, but was unaware of the months to jump in and jump out.
Do you think that the timing can be that simple? Or has things changed a tad, since he authored the book. I have been waiting for the market to do at least a 5% downturn, but so far, nothing like that.
I was wondering what you think of the new Xerox savings programs? For me, I will continue with what I have, and will wait until I see a major downturn, for me to do anything foolish. Its is hard to mess with the critical mass, and not have any worries.
But then again, Clayt is always preaching on using the S word (spend). \
Speaking of Clayt, about 1 week after he left, my wife found a rather disturbing piece of clothing stuffed into a door pouch of our Camery. It took a bit of explaining on my part, saying that a friend of Clayts named Jamie who passed away a year ago hid the same piece on underclothing in Clayts camper. So now it is my turn to continue the the prank, Look out Pocket Rocket or the Gov or mabey even Hickory.
Are you still buying Ginny Mae's? And what is the yearly return on them? I know Clayts is always tooting his horn over them.
Well time to go, and say hi to the Klinker (clayt) later---big O
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Hello big ' O ' ,
Nice to see ya post here again . I've used Sy Harding's seasonal timing methods and have had some success with it . Like traders say about technical analysis , when it works , it works . And when it doesn't work , it doesn't work . Sy has a weekly commentary on his web site at : ( http://www.streetsmartreport.com/ ) and we are now in Sy's " unfavorable season " .
I'm pretty much totally out of the stock market now awaiting a correction later this year to buy back in . I did make TWO major purchases in the Vanguard GNMA fund ( VFIJX ) this month of June . One purchase was at $10.00 a share price and the other was for $9.93 . Added to my $9.93 purchase last summer , my adverage purchase price is $9.95 a share and the GNMA dividend yield as of tonite is 5.46% . They are guaranteed by the printing presses of the federal government . I will continue to look for additional opportunities later this year at prices closer to my $9.95 adverage . I do quite a bit of posting on GNMAs on Suite101's GNMA forum at : ( http://investment.suite101.com/discussion.cfm/541 ) . All of my GNMAs are in my Roth account and I also post on Suite101's Roth forum too at : ( http://investment.suite101.com/discussion.cfm/66 ) .
The bearded one has another friend up here now that he's fishing with on the Kenai .
Trying to get used to our new Xerox 401(k) web site at : ( http://resources.hewitt.com/xerox/ ) . We just came out of lockdown yesterday . I do quite a bit of posting now on our Association of Retired Xerox Employees web site at : ( http://www.arxe.org ) . Take care . Stay away from Clayt. He's trouble . :evil:
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The February issue of the Pioneer Xpress is available on the Pioneer retiree club's web site at :
http://www.xeroxpioneerclub.org/
It's a nice big ten page issue with a 2008 membership application attached . The annual membership fee is still a big saw buck ( $10 ) . This is a good choice for those on the " right " coast however they will accept members from anywhere .
I will delete all past references to this club and their newsletters from our archives ( thank you :-) Xertech ) cause this club has all their past newsletters archived on their own site .